Please Help me with the Sump Design.

[TFMANIAC]

I'm planning to trash my 3ft internal overflow tank for something smaller and more compact.

Here are the 2 designs I've come up with after looking at the displays at Aquarama.

This is a 1.5ft cube design.

This a 2ft cube design.

I know that it's nothing Special.

You could probably find similar ones in a store somewhere but quite frankly, i've not come across any.

If anyone can hook me up on any locations, that would be helpful.

Otherwise, I've got to get it custom made.

Either way, I'm a little clueless on how the sump should look like.

The major arguement being is if the Chiller should be inside the cabinet or outside.

If it is inside, the space of the sump would be greatly compromised and then there is the heat issue.

If it is outside, you maximise the sump space, creating greater possibilites of equipment insertion but the

chiller on the outside, with the pipes and tubes, becomes an eyesore not to mention the noise.

From my amature knowledge of Sumps, this is what I have,

In this Design, the chiller will be situated outside the tank.

Yes, I know I said that it'd be an eyesore but this is where I need help.

How can I make the sump such that the Chiller can also fit in there?

Expert Reefers, please help.

[[V]tEc]

it's better to leave the chiller outside....although is an eyesore but it work much better than placing the chiller inside the cabinet

[TFMANIAC]

Vtec, That's exactly what alot of reefers have been telling me.

Isnt there a way to still enclose it? Perhaps creating sufficient ventilation with the use of fans etc?

[AquaZinYaw]

Vtec, That's exactly what alot of reefers have been telling me.

Isnt there a way to still enclose it? Perhaps creating sufficient ventilation with the use of fans etc?

I saw some of the ppl put the chiller outside and make another small cabinet for the chiller alone. Some ppl make even 2 tiers cabinet for chiller & can store tools & additive, etc... but that cabinet should have good ventilation of coz...

[TFMANIAC]

Now that's an idea AquaZinyaw. I've not seen such a thing before but it seems to be a very possible solution.

[bobiegoh]

hi bro,

Am still at kindy and this is just my thought for sharing and comments.

1/ You might want to have a bigger surface skimming. For your tank size, maybe can go for min 8".

2/ Instead of having a vertical pipe connecting to sump from tank bottom, why not drill it at the tank top (can have 2 piping) and connect it to the sump from the back. Attached is the design for your ref.

Also you might want to ref to bro Nuclear_fiber's thread (Urban Reef Concept) overflow design at back. Pretty neat design when you see it physically especially the background is black.

[TFMANIAC]

as innovative as that is, I'd like to have a tank which can be viewed from all the sides.

[Thexder]

I rather that you have a separate pump to feed the chiller. The return from chiller can be back to the last compartment. Based on your drawing, it will be very taxing on the return pump to pump through the chiller and then back up into your main tank.

[TFMANIAC]

how are chillers usually included through the system?

If the pump is a very strong one, would I still have to worry about that?

[Thexder]

Depends on the chiller that you are using. Chillers work most efficiently with a certain flow rate. If you use a very strong pump to make up for the head loss through the chiller and up to your main tank, the final flow rate may not be the most efficient for your chiller. End up your chiller will take a longer time to cool down your tank => Waste more electricity.

For my case, I was using a return pump to go through the chiller then back to main tank. The flow rate was really low. I'm using Eheim 1262 which pumps at 3400L/min. The head loss is around 50%!. Now, I switched to a separate Aquabee 2000 to feed my chiller and retain the Eheim to do return pump duty only.

[TFMANIAC]

Just to clarify, is this what you mean Thexder

So it does not really matter how strong the Chiller Powerhead is as long as the water that gets back in there is the desired temperature right?

[Thexder]

Yes, correct. The chilled water goes back to the last compartment so that it can be quickly pumped up to the main tank. More efficient that way.

[[V]tEc]

Just to clarify, is this what you mean Thexder

So it does not really matter how strong the Chiller Powerhead is as long as the water that gets back in there is the desired temperature right?

imo, i tried this set up during my 1st set up..... ur chiller will hit the set temp very fast, but ur main tank temp is still higher than the set temp...so very soon, ur chiller will start running again....not a gd idea cos u r feeding some water that juz exit from the chiller back to the chiller again. u can try feeding the chiller from the 2nd chamber of ur sump n output to the last.

else u can try using 2 return pumps. 1 direct back to main tank, 1 go to chiller, n back to main tank. alot of ppl r using this way n seriously i think this is still the best way.....

[TFMANIAC]

So it's either

#1

From 3rd Compartment of Sump --> Chiller --> back to tank

or

#2

From 2nd Compartment of Sump --> Chiller --> to 3rd Compartment of Sump --> Back to Tank

The first method seems okay but I'm afraid that if somehow the water going back into the tank is disturbed because of the 2 pumps, there might be a flooding incident. I feel it may be safer to have just one pipe that is returning water to the main tank. Correct me if I'm wrong here.

The second method apart from having more pipe work to do, seems to make efficient use of the chiller. It does make sense that earlier, freshly chilled water was continously going back into the chiller.

[stevenkoh08]

yup agreed with that but if u do not want to connect too many pipe you can consider an external thermostat go online yahoo and find Far East Refrigeration Group will be participating in The 20th International ... 112 Lavender Street, #04-00 Far East Refrigeration Building Singapore 338728cheap brought a fan motor from them for chiller just less then 2 red note

[Thexder]

Your sump is quite small so you need to plan carefully your pump sizes. On paper it looks good but in reality could be different. Both my return pump and chiller feeder pump ended up in the last compartment because my skimmer and FR already sitting in the middle compartment

[TFMANIAC]

Ya, That might be a possible Problem there Thexder. I'll look into that once the I've recieved the Tank quotation from the Tank makers. We can't just jump start a saltwater tank like a freshwater tank. So much planning to go through. After failing twice, succeeding once and then being wiped out by a dead anemone, I'm still poisoned by the hobby. My girlfriend initially poisoned me and now she has decommisioned her tank, leaving the poison in me. hehe.

So if the skimmer takes up too much space in the second compartment and I'm not able to fit in the powerhead for the chiller in there, I've got to fit it into the 3rd compartment like one of the earlier designs right?

I'm hoping there'd be enough space though.

[stevenkoh08]

there's still a way to save one pump like if your over folw pipe goes to the chiller then the filter media that will save the space but do remember to connect a valve to each end fot easy maintainance nextime

[TFMANIAC]

Steven, I get what you mean but would gravity be enough to run the water through the chiller?

Would this method be inviting more risk?

[stevenkoh08]

Steven, I get what you mean but would gravity be enough to run the water through the chiller?

Would this method be inviting more risk?

not really but not to use too strong pump maybe max 3000l/h so it won't over flow your main tank and as i say valve to control the flow

[[V]tEc]

Steven, I get what you mean but would gravity be enough to run the water through the chiller?

Would this method be inviting more risk?

if u r using a big return pump like 5k n above then maybe workable...but u need to filter the water going into ur chiller else alot of stuff will be stucked in the cooling coil which will need flushing often.....using 2 return is still 1 of the better way. if 1 pump fail, u have another one running...

[wilsontantw]

hi hope i can help you out...

with a 2 ft tank, it's almost physically impossible to house a chiller and sump tank into the bottom cabinet.

And this is the sump.

this maybe something for you to consider...

this is a 2.5'x2'x2'

the cabinet on the side is to hide the chiller.€

i think there's another bro fishtalk1517 also has a very nice design to hide his chiller. you can try to do a search on his tank thread. (sadly he recently decommed).

[TFMANIAC]

I was thinking the same thing as it would be troublesome to filter the water before it goes into the chiller... some added pipe work there.. Best if I do the 1 or 2 return pump method.

Anyway Wilson.. I saw it in your tank thread. Very snazzy. That is probably what I'll be doing as well to hide the chiller. I'll be able to construck one of those I think.

I'm still waiting for the Tank makers to send me the quotation. I'm going to have to keep an eye out in the sales threads too.