Using Cupramine

[hammy]

With increasing reefer switching to FOWLR, i feel it will be a benefit to share experiences so that our fishes can thrieve.

Keeping from softies, LPS to even SPS... i feel that FOWLR is not that easy as well when it come to control of diseases. Especilly ich and velvet... they are slowly eating our precious fishes away of we do not do anything to it. Fortunately, there is copper, which is like a pesticide to the ich and velvet parasite. I would like to share my experiences for the benefit of friends i have known in reefing.

1)Will cupramine killed the beneficial bacteria?

For a start, Seachem claimed that it willl stunned the bacteria for a period of time without killing them. So the biofilter should be safe. However, no one will really be sure unless you try it. I find that my nitrite will rise whenever i dose copper... however, it will last for only a day or less and normal filtration whereby ammonia and nitrite wil be zero will resume. Dose real slowly.

2) How much is enough?

Many reefers including myself find that 0.3ppm is more than enough to kill off all the usual parasite. Seachem advice to be 0.5ppm, however i find that is not necessary. 0.3 is equally effective and overdosing will somehow make fishes listless. taking note that copper also reduce the immunity of fishes as claimed by some doctrine.

3)Can copper be removed and can i put in coral after that?

Yes, it can be removed by carbon and i used rowa carbon. usually take more than 2 days to remove copper. I do not know whether coral can be put in after that, no experience as i am sure to stay FOWLR for a extended period of time.

4)Which testkit is good?

Dosing copper without a testkit is as good as gambling the life of your fishes.

i find API and salifert copper testkit easy and reliable. Both give me same result and eradicate all parasite at 0.3ppm.

5)What is the first symptom of overdosing?

Nitrite will rise and fishes will lose appetite. So do make sure u have ammonia ( i find ammonia alert the best), nitrite and copper testkit when administering the treatment. Ur fishes will breath more rapidly too if there is overdosing.,

6) How long the treatment should be?

14 days is enough... u will find that after 5 days, ur fishes will show signs of improvement and i maintained my temperature at 29.5. ( confirm by Pinpoint temperature monitor)

7)What should i do to make sure that the health is improved with cupramine.

I dose together with fish solution as adviced by bro javier and i find the colour improved tremendously with increase appetite . this is especially relevant when ur fishes lost appetite during treatment.

8)What should i take note?

Make sure u are not dosing reducing agents such as Prime. They will reduce copper 2plus to copper 1plus which is 10X more toxic and danger ur fishes to perish altogether. Seachem forum claimed that Prime effect should go within 24hours and should you need to use a reducing agent to get rid of chlorine, use it 24hrs in advance. That is what i do, normally i leave it abt 2 days.

Change small amount of water to reduce nitrite.

Do Not switch on UV. Some claimed it will remove copper but the truth is in cupramine, copper is make stable by attaching amine to it, just like chloramine, chlorine to amine which is a structure similar to ammonia. by exposing cupramine to high energy UV ray, the bond between copper and amine might break and cause your water to be unstable.

9)Can i maintain long term copper in my tank to prevent parasite.

As for me, i maintained abt 0.1-0.15ppm of copper in my tank long term. As long as you know what u are doing, i believe so. I have read that some LFS and foreign reefer do that without adverse effect. But do it at your risk and i will not advice to go beyond 3 months.

10)i realise i dose according to instruction. But my testkit show 0ppm. How can that be true.

It is very much posible. i advice to have 2 different testkits. Either API, salifert or red sea should be fine. Copper can be absorbed into calcium structure and remained there. i experience that when i am dosing for the first time. However subsequent dosage have no such problem.

I come from coral rearing and have the perception that copper is not good. However i find that it is so much easier than the alternative treatment hyposalinity which i have no luck with, although relatively free as compare to copper, i always find it a hassle to maintained the salinity at 1.009. and dosing and testing seem so much easier. If u ask me, i feel that every FOWLR owner should own a cupramine to standby.

I have no business with Seachem and all the writeup is solely for education and information purposes. Please do share your experiences too if there are more to contribute. Let's make this wonderful hobby more manageable.

With all been said, Cupramine is not reefsafe and 100% fishsafe, too little got no use, too much can kill your fishes, use it properly and you will reap the benefits!

[bigbird]

With increasing reefer switching to FOWLR, i feel it will be a benefit to share experiences so that our fishes can thrieve.

Keeping from softies, LPS to even SPS... i feel that FOWLR is not that easy as well when it come to control of diseases. Especilly ich and velvet... they are slowly eating our precious fishes away of we do not do anything to it. Fortunately, there is copper, which is like a pesticide to the ich and velvet parasite. I would like to share my experiences for the benefit of friends i have known in reefing.

1)Will cupramine killed the beneficial bacteria?

For a start, Seachem claimed that it willl stunned the bacteria for a period of time without killing them. So the biofilter should be safe. However, no one will really be sure unless you try it. I find that my nitrite will rise whenever i dose copper... however, it will last for only a day or less and normal filtration whereby ammonia and nitrite wil be zero will resume. Dose real slowly.

2) How much is enough?

Many reefers including myself find that 0.3ppm is more than enough to kill off all the usual parasite. Seachem advice to be 0.5ppm, however i find that is not necessary. 0.3 is equally effective and overdosing will somehow make fishes listless. taking note that copper also reduce the immunity of fishes as claimed by some doctrine.

3)Can copper be removed and can i put in coral after that?

Yes, it can be removed by carbon and i used rowa carbon. usually take more than 2 days to remove copper. I do not know whether coral can be put in after that, no experience as i am sure to stay FOWLR for a extended period of time.

4)Which testkit is good?

Dosing copper without a testkit is as good as gambling the life of your fishes.

i find API and salifert copper testkit easy and reliable. Both give me same result and eradicate all parasite at 0.3ppm.

5)What is the first symptom of overdosing?

Nitrite will rise and fishes will lose appetite. So do make sure u have ammonia ( i find ammonia alert the best), nitrite and copper testkit when administering the treatment. Ur fishes will breath more rapidly too if there is overdosing.,

6) How long the treatment should be?

14 days is enough... u will find that after 5 days, ur fishes will show signs of improvement and i maintained my temperature at 29.5. ( confirm by Pinpoint temperature monitor)

7)What should i do to make sure that the health is improved with cupramine.

I dose together with fish solution as adviced by bro javier and i find the colour improved tremendously with increase appetite . this is especially relevant when ur fishes lost appetite during treatment.

8)What should i take note?

Make sure u are not dosing reducing agents such as Prime. They will reduce copper 2plus to copper 1plus which is 10X more toxic and danger ur fishes to perish altogether. Seachem forum claimed that Prime effect should go within 24hours and should you need to use a reducing agent to get rid of chlorine, use it 24hrs in advance. That is what i do, normally i leave it abt 2 days.

Change small amount of water to reduce nitrite.

Do Not switch on UV. Some claimed it will remove copper but the truth is in cupramine, copper is make stable by attaching amine to it, just like chloramine, chlorine to amine which is a structure similar to ammonia. by exposing cupramine to high energy UV ray, the bond between copper and amine might break and cause your water to be unstable.

9)Can i maintain long term copper in my tank to prevent parasite.

As for me, i maintained abt 0.1-0.15ppm of copper in my tank long term. As long as you know what u are doing, i believe so. I have read that some LFS and foreign reefer do that without adverse effect. But do it at your risk and i will not advice to go beyond 3 months.

10)i realise i dose according to instruction. But my testkit show 0ppm. How can that be true.

It is very much posible. i advice to have 2 different testkits. Either API, salifert or red sea should be fine. Copper can be absorbed into calcium structure and remained there. i experience that when i am dosing for the first time. However subsequent dosage have no such problem.

I come from coral rearing and have the perception that copper is not good. However i find that it is so much easier than the alternative treatment hyposalinity which i have no luck with, although relatively free as compare to copper, i always find it a hassle to maintained the salinity at 1.009. and dosing and testing seem so much easier. If u ask me, i feel that every FOWLR owner should own a cupramine to standby.

I have no business with Seachem and all the writeup is solely for education and information purposes. Please do share your experiences too if there are more to contribute. Let's make this wonderful hobby more manageable.

With all been said, Cupramine is not reefsafe and 100% fishsafe, too little got no use, too much can kill your fishes, use it properly and you will reap the benefits!

Very good write up bro, i better quickly go and grab a few bottle before it run out of stock soon

[reef2]

its a very good write up indeed. where to find Cupramine ? not found in C328. I use Coppersafe instead because I cannot find Cupramine.

[orsony]

its a very good write up indeed. where to find Cupramine ? not found in C328. I use Coppersafe instead because I cannot find Cupramine.

The one operates at 24 hour is selling but recently out of stock there. You can try LCK. Steven have stock at the moment

[dachkie]

good article bro had i read this sooner i might not have lost my AT to ich recently , doing hypo is a torture to me my water bills and my fishes even thou its only in a quarantine tank, in my opinion the amount of water changes done due to hypo is definately not worth it , because doing a hypo that can kill off the ich have to be fast and the drop to 1.009 have to be done in 24hours for best effect. but that also kills off most of the bateria found in the filter which in turn raises NH4 and NO2, thats y alot of water changes are to be done , i almost finished my whole bucket of DD salt in 1 month plus 2 cartridge of Di resin and lost 1 AT ,

so all in all just to save a Powder blue which causes the whole ich problem to break out , it costs me $300+.

but like u said corals fanatics always thought that copper is bad. i think i will go and get some cupramin soon too once my powder blue is condemm to my sump and i change a new quarantine tank

[ambystoma82]

its a very good write up indeed. where to find Cupramine ? not found in C328. I use Coppersafe instead because I cannot find Cupramine.

petmart and yishun aquastar do carry stock but i duno if its out of stock

actually there is many other types of medicines available but due to e health hazards properties they din carry in local..

[sun2000]

its a very good write up indeed. where to find Cupramine ? not found in C328. I use Coppersafe instead because I cannot find Cupramine.

Seen it at Ah Beng and Petmart. More difficult to get a good test kit for copper. Found the API test kit from AM, petmart carry the Sera test kit but not sure if it was good , so did not buy it. Difficult to see the correct dosage( 0.25ppm and 0.5 ppm nearly same color) so be careful.

[bugattilambo]

Seen it at Ah Beng and Petmart. More difficult to get a good test kit for copper. Found the API test kit from AM, petmart carry the Sera test kit but not sure if it was good , so did not buy it. Difficult to see the correct dosage( 0.25ppm and 0.5 ppm nearly same color) so be careful.

I would say sera is not bad are using all their test kits

hmm so kinda worth it :eyebrow:

[hammy]

good article bro had i read this sooner i might not have lost my AT to ich recently , doing hypo is a torture to me my water bills and my fishes even thou its only in a quarantine tank, in my opinion the amount of water changes done due to hypo is definately not worth it , because doing a hypo that can kill off the ich have to be fast and the drop to 1.009 have to be done in 24hours for best effect. but that also kills off most of the bateria found in the filter which in turn raises NH4 and NO2, thats y alot of water changes are to be done , i almost finished my whole bucket of DD salt in 1 month plus 2 cartridge of Di resin and lost 1 AT ,

so all in all just to save a Powder blue which causes the whole ich problem to break out , it costs me $300+.

but like u said corals fanatics always thought that copper is bad. i think i will go and get some cupramin soon too once my powder blue is condemm to my sump and i change a new quarantine tank

thanks... i prefer copper over hypo because it is easier for me to monitor my tank... And it is a confirm proven method.

[iskay]

Anyone tried Copper Sulfate (in the form of bluish crystalline salt)?

[hammy]

Anyone tried Copper Sulfate (in the form of bluish crystalline salt)?

i think reborn sell them. even i can obtain it in my chem lab =)

just that i do not know how much to administer.

it will be easier to dose chemical with known concentration.

[chtan23]

Same here, had sucessfully use cupramine to kill all the ick in my FOWLR tank. Like what hammy had mentioned, beware of calcium structure, live rocks & sands, it will absorb the copper. I need to dose cupramine daily to maintain the right level until it stop dropping. I leave it for 3 weeks before water change then follow by carbon to get rid of the copper.

BTW, I bought mine at Aquastar few months back. The external surface of the bottle turns yellowish, can imagine the stock has been there for how long. It left 2 bottles, heard from the shop owner that there is not much demand for this, not sure if they bring in new stocks.

[hammy]

Same here, had sucessfully use cupramine to kill all the ick in my FOWLR tank. Like what hammy had mentioned, beware of calcium structure, live rocks & sands, it will absorb the copper. I need to dose cupramine daily to maintain the right level until it stop dropping. I leave it for 3 weeks before water change then follow by carbon to get rid of the copper.

BTW, I bought mine at Aquastar few months back. The external surface of the bottle turns yellowish, can imagine the stock has been there for how long. It left 2 bottles, heard from the shop owner that there is not much demand for this, not sure if they bring in new stocks.

actually no worries on that. cupramine has no expiry date and it is manufacture to last a lifetime

[moorish_idol]

HI i need help in getting the copper test kit, dun see to have it in the LFS!

[inwear]

HI i need help in getting the copper test kit, dun see to have it in the LFS!

hi Bro, you can try Polyart at C328. They have wide varity of test kit and They have cupramine for sale too. $10/- per bottle. Just went there yesterday

[Digiman]

Let me chime in a little from my experience w cupramine.

2) How much is enough?

Yap always underdose first. Normally lower than wat is recommended is good enough. Also overdosing will kill your fishes much faster than the disease will. So always underdose first and increase gradually when necessary.

3)Can copper be removed and can i put in coral after that?

I use carbon to remove the copper. After 8 months i converted the same tank to a softies tank with no problem at all. I used back the liverocks that has been coppered as well. So i dare say hardy corals like softies and some LPS can be put into the tank after a few months of carbon treatment. But more sensitive LPS and SPS are not advisable!

4)Which testkit is good?

I tried and find all test kits are not good. In other words copper is v hard to measure. However the better one is probably salifert, but to certain extent still hard to read the colours accurately.

5)What is the first symptom of overdosing?

To me the bigger angels and butterflies and triggers during overdosing the first sign is losing balance when swimming or showing abnormal swimming behaviour. During such situations change 50% of the water immediately will save the fish in time.

9)Can i maintain long term copper in my tank to prevent parasite.

Maintaining copper at low level long term to prevent disease outbreak is viable to me. However i've not tried it long term, like more than 2 years so i cant comment on the health effects on the fishes in the long run.

All in all i feel those who keep fishes, esp angels and butterflies should always have a bottle of cupramine in hand. In times of need, the fish can be caught out and out in QT or even pail and treat w cupramine.

Petmart and Ah Beng have ready supply of cupramine. Iwarna i think i saw a few bottles too.