Mega Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover - DIY!

[SantaMonica]

Today's success story is from "keifer1122" on the RS site. He got the pre-grown screen from Inland Aquatics, and put a powerful bulb on both sides (even though the screen comes only one-sided, he wanted it to grow on the other side too.) His results took six weeks. Here are his comments, highly edited for readability:

9/23: its a pre grown screen from IA. [...] my nitrates are up, its only been 2 weeks and it looks like there at a stand still, but im feeding heavily, lot of anemones in there. also where the light is the brightest theres a certain type of algae that looks like an oil spill , its got a rainbow of colors yellowish greenish brown. also no yellowing in my water. [...] i run a skimmer just cause my numbers are up there, but when there down to nuthing then ill remove.

its a 75g with 29g sump, the lights i use are 40 watt cfls comparable to 150w, but today i picked up the big daddy cfl 65 watt/300 watt comparable 3,900 lumens. so i cleaned yesterday to the point where everything was off except for the red turf that didnt come off, plus i want that to grow i think. but the screen was bare and today the screen is covered. been in for 2 weeks, not much growth the first week. but adjusted to my tank and now my first week cleaning was about the same growth that grew (lol) in one day. [...] right now i have toooo many fish... a buddy i work with was gettin out and i bought his liivestock and equip...

yellow tang

hippo tang

big royal gramma

blue green chromis

2 clownfish

mandarin

coral beauty

small bangaii cardinal

...and i only have about 35 lbs of liverock, maybe. thats pushin it. 2" sandbed, run an undersized skimmer, i think euro reef made for 55g. i test with api nitrate test, and i lost the color chart, but yellow good, red bad, im orange. and since ive been testing it looks like its getting a lighter color. [it] was usually just goin up everyday, but with the new light i think that will speed up the growing process.

9/26: i cleaned monday and today is friday, and i have to clean again. [...] the other side is getting there, still needs to catch up tho. [...] no lights on a timer, runnin it for 24/7. [although should be changed to 18 hours ON, and 6 hours OFF]. pump is on a timer, 30 [seconds] on 30 off, its just that the screen from IA was one sided and thats why the other side has to catch up.

10/23: just chimming in to say my n and p are undetectable.(!)

[Zac]

hi all been following this thread for awhile and thought that this concept is really interesting so i DIY one myself think i must change my plastic screen as this one is bended and i cant get the water to flow nicely thoughout, btw where to get the harder plastic sheets?

[SantaMonica]

Are you using a slot?

[Zac]

nope sorry what's a slot ?

[SantaMonica]

Read page 1. You'll need to cut a slot in the pipes. Also, lower the light down between the screens.

[Zac]

oh .. i c ... no wonder the flow is not even thanks santa for the help will do it on the improved version coming up next week

[Ah-lim]

oh .. i c ... no wonder the flow is not even thanks santa for the help will do it on the improved version coming up next week

Zac, may i know the light ya use?

I couldn't find those energy saving flood light in the store...

[Zac]

Zac, may i know the light ya use?

I couldn't find those energy saving flood light in the store...

Err I found this in my store so not sure the specs

[SantaMonica]

Reminder of the Day: Less Maintenance

If less maintenance is a requirement, then you want an oversize screen; try 2X normal size, with 2X the number of lights. This should be able to go 2X as long before a cleaning is needed. The limiting factor might be the pods; at some point they may make big holes in the algae (or not; you will have to test). This is a great thing for someone to try out. Just remember that the additional screen space will need the same lighting that the current screen has.

[SantaMonica]

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Many folks have been asking about the solar setup. Well that fellow is the success story of the day. "Bob the (reef)builder" on the MASA site originally set up this screen that I posted a few weeks ago:

Here are his updates:

9/21: Thank you for the input Santa monica, I will definately be doing this on an expanded basis. I think I will put a three ft tank in the sun and do what you've got on a slightly larger scale. Great simple fix to an ongoing problem by most aquarists.

9/28: The film is plastic and gets wet totally. Its 1m x 1m in size. The water input is also the stand. The strands run diagnally which makes the water flow very nicely. I'm happy with it and will let it stand in the sun. Hopefully get rid of the hair algae problem I have. You should see my actual tank to know why I jumped at this idea. The construction is so easy though. And if it works a quarter as well as Santa says it does, it will be like Christmas.

10/19: I changed this one as the upright design did not get enought sun. I put it on a 45degree angle and that was better:

10/25: It worked like a bomb. Phosphates down to 0.02 - 0.01 ppm (this is on a hanna meter and is very low). Normal test would just read undetectable. [Previously] the best I ever got it to trying every trick in the book including Zeo and Vodka, Lanthinum and many other phosphate removers was 0.03.

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[SantaMonica]

Update Of The Day: Growth Progression

Blank screens usually start off with a light brown slime of diatoms, unless the water is really high in nitrate and phosphate, in which it might start with dark spots. After a few weeks, green slime or green hair will usually grow. And from that point on, it will be a mix of brown and green, all of which is easily cleaned off. After a few months, however, and if you have enough light (and maybe pulsed flow), you may start seeing real red/brown turf, or possibly bright green turf. You'll know that they are turf because they won't come off no matter what you do, except with a razor blade.

[SantaMonica]

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Text Version:

There should not be any bubbles if a scrubber is set up correctly with smooth flow into the water below. But if you have too many bubbles, make sure the bottom of the screen goes all the way down below the waterline, so there is no waterfall off the bottom, and design the scrubber with an "under over under" divider section like some people use in sumps.

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[zipp86]

Today I read the book Advanced Marine Techniques, apparantly this system has its shortcomings as well, apparantly it disturbs the PH of the tank, competes with corals for important trace elements and I can't really remember the rest. But i did read on a thread on reef central that an Algae Filter simply isn't good enough to maintain filtration for the whole system, it's still wise to employ the use of a protein skimmer.

[SantaMonica]

apparantly it disturbs the PH

Yes, it raises it.

competes with corals for important trace elements

You think a skimmer doesn't remove trace elements?

i did read on a thread on reef central that an Algae Filter simply isn't good enough to maintain filtration for the whole system, it's still wise to employ the use of a protein skimmer

Those opinions were stated by folks who either work for a skimmer manuacturer/LFS, or, still think scrubbers work they way they did 5 or 10 years ago.

[SantaMonica]

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Results Of The Day:

Corinna on the AC site: "Think we should just call you Santa!! After 3 weeks my screen is forming wine red spots, the pods are having pod parties and making babies, the seahorses are noticeably gaining weight and the water is decidedly 'sparklier'.Thanks."

jfdelacruz on the RP site: "Overfeeding does wonders! i dont know how and why but, the ATS seems to be an extra 20 gallons for my tank because even if I overfeed, nothing in my tank seems to be going bad! water is always crystal clear too! (I do have seagel in there running for about 2 months already) this ATS is a blessing."

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[johntanjm]

Yes, it raises it.

You think a skimmer doesn't remove trace elements?

Those opinions were stated by folks who either work for a skimmer manuacturer/LFS, or, still think scrubbers work they way they did 5 or 10 years ago.

Well I'm building a new setup and I'm betting it entirely on a algae scrubber. tank is arriving possibly next week, give me 3 months and we shall see!

[SantaMonica]

Post the specs of your tank/setup/livestock, and I'll see what scrubber config/process I can recommend to start with.

[SantaMonica]

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Text Version: Nutrients, part 4

Our Tanks: High Inorganic Nutrients, Low Organic Nutrients.

The Ocean: Low Inorganic Nutrients, High Organic Nutrients.

Previous Versions:

http://www.radio-media.com/fish/Nutrients1.jpg

http://www.radio-media.com/fish/Nutrients2.jpg

http://www.radio-media.com/fish/Nutrients3.jpg

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[johntanjm]

Post the specs of your tank/setup/livestock, and I'll see what scrubber config/process I can recommend to start with.

Main Tank: 42" x 13" x 26"

Sump: Undecided

Total volume estimated: 275L (Max)

2x Screens:

Each screen will be 20" width, 24" height

Vertically hung

Lighting for algae screen:

2x 2ft FL tubes (housed in a glass tube to protect against splashes. meant to be submersible)

tubes will be placed vertically

tubes will be sandwiched between the 2 screens

Pump is capable of > 7000L/H effective flow rate (that means with head loss etc. accounted for)

[SantaMonica]

You have about a 75 U.S. gal, so you only need 75 square inches (lit both sides), or 150 square inches (lit one side). Your is lit one side, so each of your screens needs to be 75 square inches. 10 X 8 would be good. But 20 X 24 is WAY too big, especially for just 2 bulbs. Each bulb can only cover 3 or 4 inches. I have 2 bulbs for just 5 inches. For a 20" width, you'd need at least 5 bulbs. Try down sizing the screen, and get some smaller bulbs... 12" is good. Make sure they are T5HO, and 6500K should be good. After you know your screen width, multiply by 35 to get your gph.

[SantaMonica]

Reminder Of The Day:

If you are home when a power outage occurs, then just like you would manually try to oxygenate your tank, you would also take the screen out and set it in some water (even tap water in the sink.) Problem solved, no damage. It can sit there for two days with no ill effects. You could even put it in a shallow pan of water outside in the sun, where it will probaby grow

If you are not home, however, it becomes a question of which you lose first, your screen or your whole display. Long term (days) you are going to lose both, so we'll look at short term (hours). Somewhere in-between is the question: If you are not home when the power goes out for 2, 3, 4, 5 hours, etc., then how much of your screen will you lose, and how much of the nutrients will be "released" back into the water?

Well, most screens are designed to be up and out-of-contact with the water, so there will be zero "release" of nutrients during the power-outage. And floating screens that stay in contact with the water will not die or release nutrients at all in a short-term outage, because they stay wet. So immediate release of nutirents is not a factor in any situation.

The real question is long term loss of filtering, i.e., how much of the screen will die off during the outage. When you get back home, the screen has been drying for a few hours, but is still moist. What you do is put it in your sink with water and give the dead parts a chance to fall off. Not sure of how much time is needed, but just do a regular cleaning of the screen every few hours until it seems that most of the dead stuff is removed. Doing this in the sink will prevent any nutrients from getting back into the tank. You then put the screen back into operation, and it's no different than if you just did a regular cleaning. And this is the worst case.

I myself unplugged the wrong plug once and left the screen 6 hours with no flow. The fan was still on, but the lights were off at the time. It was all still moist, yet a bit hardened. I did not think at the time to remove the outer layers of dead stuff, so I just put it back into operation right way. What happened was the next day or two there was a very slight increase in N from zero (clear Salifert) to a very slight pink; probably got up to about .5 or 1. P did not ever increase, however. And this was without properly removing the dead stuff. So overall, I don't think power outages are really that eventfull for scrubbers.

[SantaMonica]

Results Of The Day:

"pong" on the RP site: "Still havent cleaned my screen... and no water change... no problems! im just killing the pods by dosing kalk and all my top-off on the screen (since early october, no cleaning of the screen, last water change... august? september?)

"jski711" on the RS site: "the last phosphate test I had done at the lfs it was undetectable on the hanna phosphate photometer, and I only have the one side of my screen lit for now!!!"

"col" on the UR site: "Todays tests are P = 0.03, N = 5. the algae looks the same, green slime. Skimmer is still running 24/7, feeding 2-3 times a day for fat fish. Algae on the rocks is subsiding, and water conditions have never been better."

[oceanus]

This is awaresome.. how many bros here try this out with success ??

but seem like alot of work to me.. hee

[andyboss]

hi bro, can share what are the components u use/needed for the scrubber? screen, pipe, etc and where do u get em?

coz pretty noob in DIY, and hopefully minimize the cost of set-up.

after all, DIY is meant to be budget. haa

TIA!

2x Screens:

Each screen will be 20" width, 24" height

Vertically hung

Lighting for algae screen:

2x 2ft FL tubes (housed in a glass tube to protect against splashes. meant to be submersible)

tubes will be placed vertically

tubes will be sandwiched between the 2 screens

Pump is capable of > 7000L/H effective flow rate (that means with head loss etc. accounted for)

[SantaMonica]

Oceanus: Can you build an LED panel for a nano?

Andy: Who are you asking?