DIY NeedleWheel Impeller pump

joolye · October 9, 2003

Hi, just to share some info on my skimmer (Berlin HO) using a modified Needlewheel Impeller by alvy. When the skimmer was original installed, the bubbles was not sufficient due to the original venturi valve that comes with its.

Alvy was kind enough to help me modifiy the existing pump impeller with a bioball to become so called Needlewheel impeller. Now with these implement, air is actually suck in through the input of the pump and "chop" into much finer bubbles. I had to remove the original venturi valve and connect the pump directly to the input of the skimmer. By right, you should install a venturi valve at the input of the pump. I did not do so as I had not order a Kent venturi valve yet. I just insert a air tube very close to the impeller. Infact the bubbles is so much that I had to put back the pump housing to control the input flow so that not too much bubbles is going into the skimmer! Overall I would say the skimmate is much much better and the bubbles is much denser and finer.

joolye · October 9, 2003

2pic of the pump

joolye · October 9, 2003

the skimmate after 3days

clowntrigger · October 9, 2003

OMG, this is great, care to take a pic at the DIY needlewheel assembly?

joolye · October 9, 2003

I can take the pic when I wash the skimmer! Anyway, I will post a pic from the internet. its lokks the same! Acutally, if the cylinder tube is much taller, you can set the pump to runs full blast and gets more bubbles! For my tube , I can't set the pump to full blast as the bubbles will infact slip into my sump!!!

clowntrigger · October 9, 2003

You are one lucky chap to have Alvy made the needlewheel for you.... I will wait for the photo then, thanks. Sorry, I prefer to see the actual thing :eyebrow: and not from the web if it does not incurr more trouble for you...

joolye · October 9, 2003

the impeller mod by alvy looks like this. (pic from internet)

nqh71 · October 9, 2003

Hi.. So sorry but how does it work... What is the principle behind it... Maybe I can do the same too...

joolye · October 9, 2003

ngh71: Some skimmer uses venturi valve at its inlet which is connected to the output of the pump to create bubbles when the water flows thru its (air is being suck in at the same time). However due to my skimmmer venturi valve design (suck!), bubbles created is not that much that its cannot cover my skimmer second cylinder tube at all (you can't see the most inner tube in the skimmer cos of the bubbles within the second tube is too dense). With the needle impeller, air is now suck in from the pump inlet and when goes into the impeller, its being chop into much finer bubbles which then causes a better skimmate...well for my skimmer lah.. Hope i did not explain wrongly!

you can read the below link for more info..

http://camelreef.free.fr/skimmer/skimmer.html

nqh71 · October 9, 2003

Hi Bro,

Thank you... Now I understand... But is it crucial to recreate the impeller as showned by you... Shouldn't it work if it is just the original impeller?

joolye · October 9, 2003

normal impeller will never chop the bubbles fine enough!

hoppinghippos · October 9, 2003

I don't understand, how do you get air into the pump in the first place? do you connect air tube to the inlet of the pump so it sucks in both air and water? And won't it be rather noisy?

alvy · October 9, 2003

i think the impellor pic from the net is a bit raw as i did trim the stokes to resemble a deltec pinwheel than wat now looks like a spinning durian!! :lol:

If ur use a normal impellor to run an aspirating venturi bubble maker, it should work(with reference to online documentation) but to get a quiet operation, a pinwheel or needlewheel is needed! the bioball is a cheap and easy upgrade to small and medium skimmers using smaller pumps (the bio ball is not big)..but to run a larger one using eheim 1260 or even 1262, the needlewheel disc will hvae to be built from scratch havinh machines to form the disc and stoke structure!

Since the bioball experiment seemed quite successful, i'll experiment with building a larger needlewheel suitable for larger pumps! the problem with constructing a proper "compact" venturi valve is still there..anyone can show me the H&S venturi valve image??need to understand the structure in order to clone one!

Crab · October 10, 2003

Found this diy venturi valve at rc. I think they fit it at the output of the pump. Does it work if it's fit to the pump input?

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.p...t=venturi+valve

clowntrigger · October 10, 2003

Hi Alvy

What do you mean by "H&S venturi valve image"? I have a H&S skimmer, I can take a pictures for you to see but first you must let me know what the hell is H&S venturi valve image

joolye · October 10, 2003

Hi Alvy! thanks for the mod. its working great and infact too powerful for the skimmer! Maybe I need not have any venturi valve which inturn need not restrict the pump output. Sorry to post one like durian impeller cos have not taken the actually impeller out yet. :paiseh:

Hippo: I did nothing to the pump inlet. I just insert the air tube very close to the impeller. when the pump is ###### in water, its causes air to be suck in thru the air tube. Oh.. its very quiet.

cmswong · October 13, 2003

HI JOOLYE,what pump u r using?

Can it take the load of modi impeller?

ALVY:the impeller resemble deltec how r u overcome the constant flowrate problem.I read from somewhere it claim pantent to the design of a slider or

flow guard to maintain the flow because the permanent magnet impeller is

not turning in one direction.

I asking all this because I had a berlin layin around and I did some study.

Hope U can help. Thanks. :bow:

joolye · October 13, 2003

cmswong: I using a red sea pump. Not the rio pump that was package with the berlin earlier. Was your skimmer comes with the rio pump?

cmswong · October 13, 2003

HI bro, mine package with eheim 1060 very erratic

joolye · October 13, 2003

Eh?? Maybe I buy recently, that's why its comes with Red Sea pump. Understand the previous Berlin is package with Rio2500 causes alot of problem. Maybe can try mod your pump and see whether its better???

In state, Most people there remove the actual venturi valve and replace its with a 3/4" Kent venturi valve and a Mag 5 or 7 pump to enhance the skimmer performance.

cmswong · October 14, 2003

Hi joolye,if u brought recently it supposed come with needle wheel impeller.

Now I worry your pump wether it can last or will it heat up ?

I am looking to modify waiting for alvy answer.

joolye · October 14, 2003

Supposed to be! But I brought the OLD version skimmer!!! Actually they are using the same pump except the impeller after checking with the local distributor. Well never do my homework before purchase. haha :cry:

Well if pump spoilt, change pump loh :lol:

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DIY NeedleWheel Impeller pump

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