Can T5 keep SPS in the long term?

[apinun]

Who ever use T5 for keep sps more than 1 year .I want to know the result of it.

Who has the article on web to compare between T5 and MH ? I need more information before i decide to buy a new lighting system for my new sps tank.

[Elune]

T5 ? erm... unless u can this 16-tube system one of the reefers here has... if not, rather hard to keep SPS with t5...

[w3ish3ng]

look at danano tank thread. his light is only t5

[damienkee]

ofcoz u can... get better bulb.

as w3ish3ng suggest.... danano's tank is the best example.

go to RC... there have even more reefer kips in HO T5.

[Elune]

Yea~ Danano's tank is " ".

He got like 8-Tubes T5s ...

[danano]

[golfmac]

and is using ATI .

Good work brother!!!

[apinun]

Conclusion is in sg.There is only one tank use T5 (Danano's tank).

[iantoh]

hi there apinun,

it might open up a larger world of T5 users if you search RC for sps and T5s. iwan uses purely T5s: see http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.p...25&pagenumber=1

I use purely HO-T5s for sps too, and there are other bros in sg doing so as well. if im not mistaken, Joe_p's using purely T5s too. ATis are fantastic, as are D&Ds. ive observed growth with Aquaz tubes too, just that colouration isnt fantastic with the Aquaz tubes as they arent 50/50 tubes like the ATi and D&D Aquablue series tubes.

cheers,

ian

[FuEl]

Person A can drive a ferrari from point A to point B.

Person B can drive a bmw from point A to point B.

Person C can drive a toyota corolla from point A to point B.

Can all cars reach point B? Simple answer is yes.

That being said, even normal FL tubes sold in hardware stores can achieve growth in sps.

Colouration in sps is another common misconception. Just because we want sps to appear colourful and aesthetically pleasing to us does not always mean it will be at its optimum health. If sps could talk I think an interesting question to ask them would be whether they would prefer to be colourful or dull.

[thc]

Person C is unlikely to drive a Toyota as they are known for their reliablity.....how about this..

Person C drives a LADA from point A to point B, however it broke down halfway causing alot of inconvenience..

Not all cars can reach point B

[ckevin]

An informative read for anyone interested. Warning 40 pages in all.

T5 on Reefcentral (intensive read)

[iantoh]

Dear bros Rex Ng and THC,

I have merely stated my opinion in response to a reefer's enquiry, and if you wish to state your opinion on your preferred choice of bulb manufacturer, please do, but do try to refrain from needlessly slamming another's products.

[olezontie]

The differentiation between good and bad T5 tubes are not the PAR they give out when you fire them. Most tubes will probably give similar illumination/intensity during the FIRST HOURS OF FIRING. The true differenting factor is how long can they maintain the illumination/intensity.

Aquaz T5 might have been demonstrated to promote growth for a period of time. The key question is how long can the tube sustain the growth.

My personal experience is that I find that the Aquaz tube don't last very long (not longer than 3 months) and it seems that I am not the only person who has similar experience.

I don't agree that it is more economical to use Aquaz tubes even though they are 1/3 the price of the others. I will have to change the tubes every 3 months and the price will be comparable, not to mention the trouble I have to go through changing the tubes.

I also don't agree that all cars can reach point B. I don't think I can rely on candle light to grow SPS, can I?

And as for the comment on colouration and asking the corals about what they prefer is ridiculous. It is like asking: does the sun prefers to rise from the east. Zhuang Zi has already pointed out centuries ago that this is a ridiculous comment and an endless argument. We should not waste time on it.

[iantoh]

i agree with you bro oleozontie, that you cant grow sps with candle light, but there are more brands of T5s than ATi and D&D, and it isnt exactly a comprehensive or fair discussion to limit T5s to just these two brands.

I also think that utilizing an appropriate e-ballast to fire up T5 tubes is an important aspect. if youre overdriving ATi tubes using an Ice-Cap e-ballast, as theyve found on on RC, they only last for about six months before visually discernable spectrum shifts occur. Ati tubes however, do last, in my personal experience, about 2 years on a normal ballast, whilst the Aquaz tubes last for about 8 to 9 months on an average e-ballast. Neither am i trying to say that the Aquaz tubes are a better bang for the buck because they are 1/3 the price of better brands, because if they were, i wouldnt be using ATis. im just merely placing on the table the various options one has when considering T5 tubes. i mean, a student who only has a fifty bucks budget for the hobby per month, even if they would like ATi tubes, might not be able to afford it, and in that sense, might decide to do with using Aquaz tubes but changing more often. Its just like why i choose to use Resun chillers and just get a new one when it fails rather than paying four times more for an Artica. They are of different quality clearly, and id love an Artica, but SRC and other platforms exist for the discussion of the hobby and of possible alternatives to every solution, so its what suits one's needs best. the Aquaz discussion only arose as a result of Rex NG and THC's comments.

cheers,

ian

[damienkee]

iantoh, i agree with u. this thread is mainly focus on can T5 keep sps in long term? not on which T5 tube is better or which type is lousy.

and even me, myself is using Aquaz HO T5 tube b4. yes! I have acceptable growth rate. i can frag my table top 1-2 times a month. juz e lifespan for this tube is abit short... thats y I switch to others.

so, lets get back to the topic.

[FuEl]

When I mentioned that sps can even grow using normal FL tubes, it does happen if you do your setup properly. This would mean shallow tanks and lots of FL tubes. SPS are capable to adapting to extremely low light (Titlyanov et al., 2001).

Even if a certain brand of T5 does produce better PAR, it does not neccessarily mean the increased photosynthesis seen in sps will lead to increased calcification (growth as we commonly call it). Interactions between calcification and photosynthesis still remain unresolved and are still matters of continuous controversy (Houlbrèque et al., 2003).

As such, I don't understand the statement by which someone made regarding a certain brand of T5 unable to achieve growth.

There are many other factors that affect growth in SPS besides light. Other factors include feeding (Houlbrèque et al., 2003) and water motion (Dennison and Barnes, 1988). Growth in sps is thus a combination of various variables. Very often in aquaria, we often blame it on light when the limiting factor could have been otherwise.

Marketing hype for aquarium lighting often plays on the lack of understanding on sps growth. Colouration in SPS is always held in high regard, although it is often not related to sps health at all. This is nothing but a common effect of anthromorphism. The comment on colouration is not a ridiculous one. If so many other people could be considered ridiculous as well. Check out this article and notice the comment made by Andy. Like how clownfish fare better physiologically without an anemone host, why could'nt SPS benefit more by being brown? I quote from the following article by Dr Ross J. Jones. "Corals gain most of their brown colouration from the photosynthetic pigments of the symbiotic algae (zooxanthellae) in their tissues. When corals bleach, either they lose zooxanthellae, or the zooxanthellae lose their pigments, or both." From this statement one can simply infer that brightly coloured sps will be more prone to bleaching compared to brown ones, simply because they have less zooxanthellae.

Thank goodness sps are being aquacultured. If they are not, probably all the SPS will be left in the oceans in distant future would be brown. No SPS would want to appear attractive as that would simply warrant their removal from the oceans. Simple basics of selection pressure on evolutionary change.

I was once an avid ATI fan, but seeing the way the brand is being marketed right now simply puts me off. It kind of reminds me of the recent elections which I will not dwell on. I'm sure there are other reefers who feel the same. My next T5 choice would certainly be any brand but ATI.

References

http://www.reefs.org/library/article/borne...iss_nguyen.html

http://www.spc.int/coastfish/News/LRF/3/2Jones.html

Titlyanov, E. A., Titlyanova, T. V., Yamazato, K., Woesik, R. v., 2001.

Photo-acclimation dynamics of the coral Stylophora pistillata to low and extremely low light. Journal of Experimental Marine Biology and Ecology 263 (2), 211-225.

Houlbrèque, F., Tambutté, E., Ferrier-Pagès, C., 2003. Effect of zooplankton availability on the rates of photosynthesis, and tissue and skeletal growth in the scleractinian coral Stylophora pistillata. Journal of Experimental Marine Biology and Ecology 296(2), 145-166.

Dennison, W. C., Barnes, D. J., 1988. Effect of water motion on coral photosynthesis and calcification. Journal of Experimental Marine Biology and Ecology 115(1), 67-77.

[iantoh]

Hi there bro Damienkee, thanks. Glad to know the thread is regaining its focus on bro Epinun's query.

Bro Fuel, thanks for that insightful explanation. We certainly do need to rethink some of the "gospel truths" taken for granted in this hobby.

cheers,

ian

[thc]

Iantoh, my apologies to you on the harsh comments on the sps growth thingy…

I have reasons for the harsh comments on Aquaz products, am definitely not against you.

I do agree with you on the usage of a suitable e-ballast for the T5s. Overdriving the T5s will definitely shorten the life span of a tube and it also causes rapid spectrum shift. I wired four 80W T5 Blue tubes (2 ATIs and the rest can’t reveal) to the Ice-Cap 660 for a reefer some months back (appr. 3 months). Although the blue spectrum had shift, the Blue plus is still showing but the rest loses the blue spectrum in jus 2 weeks.

Aquaz tubes shouldn’t be tabled if you were considering students with low budget. Aqualight produces good light at very affordable price. Alternatively, students can save up for better tubes available in the market.

Once again, pls accept my apologies.

Cheers

[loster]

wow... interesting discussion here

interesting article fuei

base on my own personal experience, i have some sps that are being shaded at the near bottom of my tank. it hardly has enough lights. yet, it still grows like nobody business. even thought, its colour is not that great so, keeping a good health and growing sps is not just about lighting (it is still important for growth and colouration) but feeding, flow and low nutrients and stable parameters also need to factor in. i feed a lot to my fish(s)... so, that is also contributing food to my corals.

i use aqualight T5 for my light supplement my colony of purple digitata grows well and colour well under my aqualight (10kk) on the area where my MH can't reached. hehehe as you know i have limited space in my tank... i have one colony of purplish-pink mille placed on the bottom on my tank after some scaping (no space for it ) it loses some of its colour after sometime. so, i glued it at the back wall on my tank in the mid hight... now, almost a week. and its colour comes back and has many more new growth tips it is under my "cheap" aqualight 10kk and coralblue lighting

okie... happy reefing

[thc]

This is way of topic, but I have to clarify.

Jun kai,

You never fail to amaze with your insightful posts. I know for proper colourations and growth of sps many factors affecting them; I was jus being very biase on my comments.

I agree that the recent spade of attacks or comments is very distasteful. But do you know that those so called “honest and trust worthy” merchants were doing a lot of ugly and despicable things. You may or may not have heard stories on the battle of the ATI tubes from some people. I did verification on the rumour of the ATI and also have the so-call better tubes. I have spoken to Oliver (Owner of ATI) personally and was very shocked to find out the truth of all happenings in Germany.

ATI continues to produce their tubes in Germany but they have shifted production to another factory because of some quality control issue. The so-called better tubes have their source of tubes from the previous manufacturer of the ATI.

In fact, the so-call better tube shares their tube source with another well-known brand, or should I say they are actually the same tube. You’ll notice the resemblance if you have a chance to see them fired together.

The recent attacks may appear to you as a marketing strategy, but those statements that I’ve made are all truth. I sincerely hope that they wouldn’t irk you and stop you from buying a good tube.

Having said my piece, I shall not dwell on this further. Truth will Prevail one day..

Cheers

Daniel

[madmac]

Who ever use T5 for keep sps more than 1 year .I want to know the result of it.

Who has the article on web to compare between T5 and MH ? I need more information before i decide to buy a new lighting system for my new sps tank.

'I need more information...', What you need to ask yourself first is, how can I meet the energy requirements of the SPS I have, and specifically using light only.

From a biological standpoint, FuEL is absolutely right about using jus about any lighting, irrespective of brand, .... so long as you can meet their requirements, they will grow. Generally speaking, a lower colour temperature will result in faster growth, while a higher temp will bring out different shades of colour. There are ways to determine if they have receive enough, too little or too much light, alot of it is only after you get started, and not before.

The difficulty in answering a question like this is, we don't know what type of SPS you have in the first place and what your intention is, besides a new SPS tank. All this is assuming you have what it takes to keep them alive for more than a short period of time.