WAnna start a 2 ft

[Fyn]

Hi bros,

Am planning of starting a 2ft tank but have alot of queries... Looked through some books but i guess those are better for me to learn on the species and stuff...

Am planning this all alone and cos dun have any frens whom i noe that i can look up to...

But as for the basic set up...

Would really like to find out more from the bros here with prectical experience...

Got a few questions (looked around the forum but all the short forms looked very foreign to me)...

1>> What are the substrates needed for the sump tank?

2>> How many partition do i need to have?

3>> Should i purchase sea salt for the water or is there another alternative which i use?

4>> How long do i need to really run the water for b4 adding in life rocks?

5>> Wat type of lighting should i use?

6>> Given a 2ft x1.5ft x 1.8ft tank, how many fishes can i have?

7>> Is a canister and skimmer needed if i have a sump tank? (have seen alot of bros having these)

8>> Is there anything that i miss out for a basic set up?

[Alvin Tan]

Hi bros,

Am planning of starting a 2ft tank but have alot of queries... Looked through some books but i guess those are better for me to learn on the species and stuff...

Am planning this all alone and cos dun have any frens whom i noe that i can look up to...

But as for the basic set up...

Would really like to find out more from the bros here with prectical experience...

Got a few questions (looked around the forum but all the short forms looked very foreign to me)...

1>> What are the substrates needed for the sump tank?

2>> How many partition do i need to have?

3>> Should i purchase sea salt for the water or is there another alternative which i use?

4>> How long do i need to really run the water for b4 adding in life rocks?

5>> Wat type of lighting should i use?

6>> Given a 2ft x1.5ft x 1.8ft tank, how many fishes can i have?

7>> Is a canister and skimmer needed if i have a sump tank? (have seen alot of bros having these)

1) u can choose to got barebottom or hav a thin layer of sand...IMO....small tanks are nt recommended to have DSB...

2) wad kind of partition are u referring to?..

3) some LFS sell natural sea water so u can purchase from dere if not u can use saltmix....

4) for NSW...u can add in the rocks after 1-2 daes...for saltmix..best to add them in after 10 daes..

5) for a mini reef tank..go for T5HO....for a fowlr setup...FL shld do..

6) for clowns maybe less den 10, for tangs not more den 3.. ..

7) having a sump tnak act as ur filtration..thus no need canister filter liaoz..skimmer is a must if u wan to plan to add more fishes den corals inside ur tank...

happy reefing...

[Terryz_]

6) for clowns maybe less den 10, for tangs not more den 4.. ..

You wanna kenna flamed by making this statement... A lot of reefers dun even agree to put one tang in a two...

[Alvin Tan]

6) for clowns maybe less den 10, for tangs not more den 4.. ..

You wanna kenna flamed by making this statement... A lot of reefers dun even agree to put one tang in a two...

my friend....above is jus my opinion...my new tank got 6 tangs.. ...going to kick out 1 liaoz... ...5 fishes will do...

actually....really not recommended to keep tangs...but the temptation....woah..

[Fyn]

Bro, thanx for the quick reply, but wat are DSB? i dun understand the short forms... paiseh...

for a mini reef tank..go for T5HO....for a fowlr setup...FL shld do..

Wat is T5HO and fowlr?

The partition is talking about inside the sump tank... Do i need to add anything in the sump tank???

[jem]

1>> What are the substrates needed for the sump tank?

Planning to get a refugium?(requires sand)..

Going for biological/mechanical filtration?(bioballs/coralchips)..

2>> How many partition do i need to have?

Depends on your planned space for your equipments and subtrates..

And wheter u want to add a refugium for your sump

3>> Should i purchase sea salt for the water or is there another alternative which i use?

some local fish shop(lfs) sells Natural Sea Water in jerry cans or big plastic bags..

that is the other alternative

4>> How long do i need to really run the water for b4 adding in life rocks?

can start adding live rocks once your water salinity is stabilised

5>> Wat type of lighting should i use?

what type of setup u planning to keep?

FOWLR (begineer)

Reef Tank

Soft Corals?..(slightly easier require PL lightings at least)

LPS(hard skeleton corals)..(advance harder..requires more light attention [T5]?)

SPS ...(expert require 150w or more MH lighting)

6>> Given a 2ft x1.5ft x 1.8ft tank, how many fishes can i have?

Depends on your skimmer and filtration settings..

the better ur skimming and filtration..the more fishes u can keep..

and what type of fishes u keeping?

7>> Is a canister and skimmer needed if i have a sump tank? (have seen alot of bros having these)

A skimmer is a must!..

A canister..mostly people use them if the dont have a sump tank..

but some kiasu ones add a canister for extra filtration which is not really necessary

8>> Is there anything that i miss out for a basic set up?

Just shoot me if there is any queries ill be here to help =)

[Alvin Tan]

Bro, thanx for the quick reply, but wat are DSB? i dun understand the short forms... paiseh...

Wat is T5HO and fowlr?

The partition is talking about inside the sump tank... Do i need to add anything in the sump tank???

DSB is deep sand bed...

fowlr is fish only with liverocks...

T5HO is T5 lightings(high output)...

is best to get a ready made sump.....some reefers prefer to add media but some dun...

cheers..

[jem]

DSB is also known as Deep Sand Bed..

used in a refugium area in a sump tank =)..

or used as a base for a main tank..

it refers to adding a thick coating of sand more than 4"-5"

DSB are known to use to control nutrient levels if used correctly..

[Terryz_]

Now to answer Fyn's Qns..

1>> What are the substrates needed for the sump tank?

There is actually no need for Substrate in the Sump unless you wan a remote DSB in the Sump tank.

2>> How many partition do i need to have?

It wound depend on the design of your sump...

Normally is 3 compartment...

3>> Should i purchase sea salt for the water or is there another alternative which i use?

One is to use salt mix...

Two to buy NSW from LFS that sells them..

4>> How long do i need to really run the water for b4 adding in life rocks?

I normally add them after 2-3 days...

5>> Wat type of lighting should i use?

That would depend on the stock that you wanna keep...

For coral, T5(Lps) -MH(SPS)..

For FOWLR, FL or PL will suffice

6>> Given a 2ft x1.5ft x 1.8ft tank, how many fishes can i have?

Also dependant on the size and species of the fish...

7>> Is a canister and skimmer needed if i have a sump tank? (have seen alot of bros having these)

Canister is not needed as you have a compartment to place the wool to trap the dirt when you have a sump...

A skimmer is a must for Reef Tank...

8>> Is there anything that i miss out for a basic set up?

Nothing much liao actually... Do more reading..

[Fyn]

Bro jem and bro alvin, Thanx for the fast respond...

I am looking at havin a reef tank... with soft corals as those are wat i am really fascinated about... not really the fishes... heez...

What lighting is better and as for the sump tank, get a refugium or biological/mechanical filtration i better?

If i am concentrating on soft corals with at most 4-5 fishes, is skimmer still a must?

[jem]

for the sump..

u can have either biological/mechanical filtration with refugium

or biological/mechanical filtration without refugium

or refugium without bio/mech filtration..

but the filter wool is sure a must to put to rid the dirtss..

yes!..a skimmer is always a must!

the recommended setup i can suggest is

-2ft Tank with sump

-T5

-Chiller

-Skimmer (macro needlewheel suggested)

-Fluidised reactor with phospate remover

[Terryz_]

Bro jem and bro alvin, Thanx for the fast respond...

I am looking at havin a reef tank... with soft corals as those are wat i am really fascinated about... not really the fishes... heez...

What lighting is better and as for the sump tank, get a refugium or biological/mechanical filtration i better?

If i am concentrating on soft corals with at most 4-5 fishes, is skimmer still a must?

I would still recommend you to get T5 HO for soft coral, perhaps 2-4 tubes...

A refugium is there to place Macroalgae to help with nutrient export... you will have to provide lighting for the Macroalgae to grow and prune them regularly to prevent them from dying and releasing the nutrient back in to your tank...

It also provide a alternative for you to have a Remote DSB in your Sump tank which will help you in reducing Nitrate...

A skimmer is a must as it skims out DOC in the water to keep the water clean...

[Terryz_]

for the sump..

u can have either biological/mechanical filtration with refugium

or biological/mechanical filtration without refugium

or refugium without bio/mech filtration..

but the filter wool is sure a must to put to rid the dirtss..

yes!..a skimmer is always a must!

for soft corals..

the recommended setup i can suggest is

-2ft Tank with sump

-T5

-Chiller

-Skimmer (macro needlewheel suggested)

-Fluidised reactor with phospate remover

I would agree with Jem's recommended basic setup...

It is just a very basic setup to keep your LS happy and alive...

[Fyn]

Thanx bros, will keep this in mind... planning my budget now...

How much will this all roughly cost?

[jem]

-2ft Tank with sump

(with a cabinet,be prepared to pay for a new setup around $200-$500)

-T5HO

(4 tubes would cost u around $100-$250)

-Chiller

[depends on the branding..

-Resun (cheapest)

-Daiel,RR,Teco(more expensive..by the 100s)

(Recommend u to get a Resun CL280($240-$350)/Resun CL450($300-$400)

remember the bigger the chiller the more effecient it is to cool down ur tank

and..getting a better chiller would save u the hassle of upgrading next time if u plan to go for a bigger tank

-Skimmer (macro needlewheel suggested)

Macro 300AP $80-$200?..if im not wrong..not really sure of the pricing

or

if u can afford a beckett..it would definitely be much better and effecient

beckett would cost u around $300-$450

-Fluidised reactor with phospate remover

depends on the branding too..

Resun one would cost u around $25-$55?

well..u can always find good bargains at the Pasar Malam(Buy/Sell) shop in this forum..

=)

[andylee]

2 ft tank with sump without cabinet - $100

Liverock 30kg - $90

Normal airstone skimmer - $10

T5HO - $100

budget set-up

[Fyn]

hmm... the cheap set up sound good but if wan something good on the long run den really have to properly plan le...

[Fyn]

oh, may i ask, why are some tanks called nano reef? wat issit about?

[Terryz_]

It is a tank with volume less than 30gallons...

Your should be considered a Nano but Nano the water parameter need to monitered as it is very prone to changes...

But with proper setup should do just fine...

[Alvin Tan]

It is a tank with volume less than 30gallons...

Your should be considered a Nano but Nano the water parameter need to monitered as it is very prone to changes...

But with proper setup should do just fine...

anyway....do u have the formula to calculate the total volume of water in a tank?..

[iantoh]

Hi bros,

Am planning of starting a 2ft tank but have alot of queries... Looked through some books but i guess those are better for me to learn on the species and stuff...

Am planning this all alone and cos dun have any frens whom i noe that i can look up to...

But as for the basic set up...

Would really like to find out more from the bros here with prectical experience...

Got a few questions (looked around the forum but all the short forms looked very foreign to me)...

1>> What are the substrates needed for the sump tank?

2>> How many partition do i need to have?

3>> Should i purchase sea salt for the water or is there another alternative which i use?

4>> How long do i need to really run the water for b4 adding in life rocks?

5>> Wat type of lighting should i use?

6>> Given a 2ft x1.5ft x 1.8ft tank, how many fishes can i have?

7>> Is a canister and skimmer needed if i have a sump tank? (have seen alot of bros having these)

8>> Is there anything that i miss out for a basic set up?

hi fyn,

i am quite longwinded, cause i always think of the things i wish someone told me when i first started reefing, and i think most beginners arent so likely to search the archives so ill try to type out what i can think of ya. sorry bout the length. i agree with the recommendations of bros jem and all. just thought id expand abit more on the reasons as to why they recommend what they recommend as i know it can be a blur when one is just starting out, and knowing the reasons behind things always helps in decision making.

1) sump substrate.

If youre planning on using a substrate, it must be at least of 2inches depth, consisting of fine oolithic sand. grade 0 or 1 is best. fine sand allows for a more compact sandbed with greater bacterial surface area, and facilitates a good gradient of oxygen levels to cultivate the various bacterial strains for denitrification. in our tanks, any food that is fed to the tank's inhabitants, regardless of whether this food is eaten or not, it eventually becomes waste, and will break down into ammonia, then nitrites, then nitrates. in a 4inch deep DSB, the sandbed surface and top half to one inch is aerobic (plenty of oxygen), and this area, along with the water column itself, harbours bacteria (nitrosomata sp.)that will convert ammonia to nitrites and nitrites to nitrates. within the next three inches, there will be different gradients of oxygen penetration. areas where you have rocks overhead will experience less oxygen higher up than areas without rocks overhead, etc. this area of low oxygen will harbour bacteria (nitrobacter sp.) that will break down nitrates into nitrogen and oxygen gas.

so my recommendation is that if youre planning to have any substrate at all in your sump, that it be of grade 0 or 1 oolithic sand, and of 4inches depth. you can get oolithic sand from aquamarin or at henry's (marinelife).

personally, i dont use sand in my sump as i wanted an open (no partitions sump), but a DSB is certainly great to have. for me, my DSB is in my display. for denitrification to occur, at least 2inches of sand is needed, so the next question is: are you planning on adding sand into your display? if yes, try for two inches. any less and youll facilitate the breakdown of ammonia and nitrites into nitrates, but not break nitrates down into its constituent parts- that is, youll have an incomplete nitrogen cycle, which will cause accumulation of nitrates.

2) sump partitions

if you are sure about your skimmer and other equipment choices already, then you can designate your partition spaces to accomodate them. normally, one side will have the down-flow from the main tank, this will go up one partition to enter the main sump section where you will probably place your substrate, then water flows from here to the third section where water is returned to your display tank.

youll need to check out some sump drawings and then compare them with your needs before designing your own. ill post one up on this thread when i get back home.

3) salt water:

seawater- personally, Id recommend natural seawater bought from LFS, especially for beginners, as everything is already ionically balanced, including salinity and alkalinity and calcium. this saves you having to buy salt which is far more expensive than seawater, and an RO/DI unit or distilled water to mix your salt-mix with. its also far more convenient with NSW as you wont have to mix the water, require a tub to do so, place powerheads in there to stir it up, etc.

PLEASE however, quarantine the NSW that you buy should you decide to go this way. it is possible that protozoans and other unwanted microscopic creatures are present in the water, so quarantining is best. place the bags or jerry cans of water in some corner of your home or toilet, and leave it there for a week. after that, its good to go. this has served me my four years of reefing.

you can buy NSW from Irwana at pasir ris farmway two at $1 a bag or $2 a jerry can. the bag holds about 20litres. also, if you require volume, 1 tonne of seawater can be delivered to your place (below 13 storeys for flats) for $80.

salt mixes- salt mixed water is good as its packaged dry. and is more convenient than seawater to buy and bring back. the parameters are usually great too, but you have to get the better brands. the choice then is basically between the chore of mixing and having the space to do so, or the chore of buying NSW.

4) cycling.

you can add in the live rocks immediatly after you have the water in your tank. the issue is more to do with the live rocks. if the live rocks are properly cured, they will contain little die-offs from transportation, and not add unwanted nutrients to your tank. if they are not properly cured, then stuff that has died within the rocks during transit will decompose in your tank.

either way, cycling should begin after you add your rocks as most of the bacteria you wish to seed a tank with will come from the rocks and seawater together. Leave the rocks and water with everything running without light for a week, and then check your parameters. if theres nothing amiss, that is, no high nitrate levels, youll be good to go, and can start adding livestock. though do try to do this slowly. your tank will take time to meet the bioload that it has to deal with so adding alot of fish at one time may not be a good idea.

5) lightings.

HO-T5 as bro jem recommended is a great choice. should you decide to upgrade your lights, they will have a decent resale value, plus you can always add more tubes to increase your lumens. many people have had good success keeping all manners of corals under HO-T5 lightings.

Nature aquarium at balestier road sells HO-T5 sets of 3 tubes in a 3ft casing for $120 without tubes which is a pretty good deal. they come in atman light casings allowing you to easily mount it, plus prevent salt creep on the light tubes themselves.

for your tank's height though, a single 150w or 250w metal halide lamp might be better, as that would not cost so much more than the HO-T5s, and youll be sure of getting enough light everywhere. though this will add an immense heat load to your tank. if youre not plannign on getting an overpowered chiller, then HO-T5s will be better.

Livestock.

how many fishes you can keep depends on the size of the fishes, and the species of the fishes. the larger the fish, the greater a bioload it places on your system. a big fish eats and poops more than a small one. do you have some fishes in mind which youd like to keep? if you like tangs for example, you should have no more than one, maybe two, small tangs in your system. likewise, no more than two angels. and definitely not two tangs and two angels as these will contest each other for territory. tangs are grazers and will go from area to area to feed. angels are harvesters however, and will preside over a given area as its territory and may get agressive with other fish. smaller fish like psuedochromis, chromis, damsels, gobies, firefish, etc, you can have more of, but with fishes, try to have as little as possible. with time, and if you stock slowly and read more, youll learn more about the compatibility of fishes and will progress well. to each his own int his respect.

look out for fish that are conspecific agressive though. dont house a basslet with another basslet, even agressive tangs with other such like tangs, etc.

canister/skimmer.

in my opinion, there is no real need for a canister in a marine aquarium. what the canister is to freshwater aquariums, the fluidised reactor is for marine aquariums. you can place filtering media like carbon and rowaphos, etc, in a canister filter, but it wont work as well as in a fuidised reactor. and fluidised reactors are often cheaper.

skimmer: a skimmer is of utmost importance in a marine aquarium. it skims out organics from the water column that would otherwise breakdown in your tank, and is the principal mode of nutrient extraction for most reefers. a skimmer is ajudged by its flow rate and skimming capability, because inorder for a skimmer to do its job, water with organics must first flow through it, so the great a skimmer's flow capacity, the better. also, higher end venturi or needle wheel skimmers like beckett and bubble king models are more efficient. if youre going to plump out $200 for a macro or something, you may as well spend another hundred odd more and get a beckett as youd hardly ever need to upgrade thereafter. in my personal experience, upgrading presents the largest cost in this hobby. ive had numerous skimmers prior to my present beckett and if id gone with the beckett from the start, id have saved a bundle.

overflow.

another important aspect would be the main tank's overflow. inorder for the sump to do its job of filtering the tank's water, water from the display must reach the sump, and turnover itself sufficiently to ensure most of the water reaches the sump. do aim for good dynamic flow in the display tank too.

well, im getting tired typing now. hope your first tank goes well ya bro! do tell us where you live. i'm sure bros staying near you will be willing to meet you for a coffee or somehting and give you a hand. hope this post helps.

cheers,

ian

[May&Bruce]

Easiest for me is to measure the length (L), breadth ( and height (H) in cm, then multiply together and divide the total by 1000. This will tell you the volume in litres. Then divide the total litres by 3.875 to give you the volume in US gallons, or by 4.5 to give you Imperial gallons.

Example: 2 foot x 1.5 foot by 1.5 foot

in cm is 61 cm x 46 cm x 46 cm = 129,000 cubic centimeters (approx)

divide by 1000 gives you a volume of 129 litres.

divide vol in litres by 3.875 gives you a volume of 33.3 US gallons.

If you want to be quite accurate, use the internal dimensions of the tank, not the external dimensions (to conisder thickness of the glass).

[thanantosis]

IANTOH.... u r foverever so super helpful!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Fyn]

Hey bros, thank you all very much for all these helpful information, especially bro iantoh... hahaha... indeed its taxing to go through the archives... but one thing is that archive very messy oso leh...

[jem]

=)

i think the most stressful part is pumping money into this hobby..

well..a lil advice..

purchase the more expensive and effective equipments..

it will serve you well and give u less headaches in the near future..

from my experience..

i spent most of my money upgrading...

which is a waste of time and money..

and..

try not to trust LFS too much..

do researchs on equipments/livestock u r buying..

Hope that helps someway or another