Efficiency Of Dual Protein Skimmers

[PornStar]

Can anyone enlighten me on the following.

For example, if I have 2 identical protein skimmers in my sump rated for 200 litres each, does it mean:

1) The skimmers are now able to accomodate a system with a total volume of 400 litres?

OR

2) The skimmers are now twice as efficient in skimming a 200 litre system?

How does this work out? I'm sure it's not like some electrical circuit theory thingy.

And I'm not gonna ask how the skimmers perform if put in parallel or serial sequence. But in case if anyone knows, I would be most willing to listen.

Thanks!

[PornStar]

No one?

I'm asking this cos I have a spare skimmer and was just wondering if there's any use for it besides selling it off.

[bawater]

1) in theory yes. but in practical, depends on the brand. Most asian models are under rated.

2) yes, twice as efficient.

Running in sequence will give you a real 2nd pass skimmer. All those on the market that say double or triple pass don't count because water only mixes with air in one chamber. You only count how many times the actual mixing takes place.

If the skimmer is pretty good at its job then on the second pass you should get little or no foam at all(which then makes the second skimmer a waste of space).

If it does pull out thick foam then the skimmers are not that well designed or made.

Running in parrallel would be a better option. placing the skimmers side by side or at either end of the sump will ensure that the total sump volume goes through the skimmers. You can't overskim(as u only skim the volume of the sump at any given time), it gives you more freedom in feeding.

i run this method with a ruwal 250(1500ltr pump) and a weipro 2014(2000ltr pump)one on either end of the refugium.My sump is 3ft.

[PornStar]

i run this method with a ruwal 250(1500ltr pump) and a weipro 2014(2000ltr pump)one on either end of the refugium.My sump is 3ft.

On either end?

I though it would be best to run it pre-refugium but isn't it detrimental to have it post-refugium? Doesn't that remove/eliminate the nutrient export?

[bawater]

why would it eliminate nutrient export. isn't it already eliminated.

If you worry about it affecting pods, it seems pods are much more clever than that. both me & rumour have seen pods running around in the skimmer it seems the turbulance didn't bother them.

Having one at either end will actually show u the difference a refugium makes. the one pre refugium churns out kopi-o while the other churns out teh-o(if it foams at all in my case). i used my setup just an example- u may if you want run both side by side pre refugium or post refugium.There are no hard rules, as long as it works for your setup. just that the skimtration results(i just made that word up) are better that a serial setup.

[PornStar]

Thanks Ba,

I will try and see how it works out for my tank.

Most appreciated.

[Achilles Tang]

why would it eliminate nutrient export. isn't it already eliminated.

If you worry about it affecting pods, it seems pods are much more clever than that. both me & rumour have seen pods running around in the skimmer it seems the turbulance didn't bother them.

Having one at either end will actually show u the difference a refugium makes. the one pre refugium churns out kopi-o while the other churns out teh-o(if it foams at all in my case). i used my setup just an example- u may if you want run both side by side pre refugium or post refugium.There are no hard rules, as long as it works for your setup. just that the skimtration results(i just made that word up) are better that a serial setup.

Bawater, is this observation consistent?

IMO, once a certain amount of time has passed, the water and all its nutrient load in all parts of a reef system (main tank, refugium, sump) should be at an equilibrium.

I don't really think that part A will be cleaner than part B such that a skimmer will be able to pull out more junk vs a skimmer just barely a meter away just because the water moves over a refugium, where in theory, the algae is supposed to uptake the nutrients... but for this to happen... the uptake rate must really be super fast and efficient...

Could it be because that skimmer A (pre-refugium) has already cleaned the water... so that skimmer B has less to clean? (Assuming that skimmer A is extremely efficient).

So in theory, a super efficient skimmer now placed at B will still be able to pull out a lot of gunk even if a much less efficient skimmer was placed at A with a refugium!

[bwilly]

eh, to put in figures could be like this.

Same rate of skimming.

Under Parallel running -

Protein Skimmer 1 : 25% uptake of skimming done in area A.

Protein Skimmer 2 : another 25% uptake of skimming done in area A too.

Parallel = 50% skimming constant

Under serial -

Protein Skimmer 1 : 25% uptake - Area A

Protein Skimmer 2 : 75% (assume refugium 1/4 size of tank, approportion accordingly) uptake - Area B - (18.75%)

Serial - 18.75% + 25% = 43.75%

Skimmed water is pass thru Area A to B, n less goo to skim.

Unless different rate of skimmer is place at different places.

Of course then different story.

[bawater]

What i see is only in my tank because so far i'm the only one running it that way.

but 1 in a million is not conclusive. there are other factors like my bigger refugium footprint & lower flow through the sump.(which totals not more than 800ltrs/h)

Its my personal sump experiment for this year. most probably add in a few tweaks & rebuild a new one next yr based on the present results.

The example is for pornstar to play around with & try because he will be using 2 identical skimmers and the results would be better if he ran in parallel instead of serial.(parallel allows more volume to be skimmed)

that also does depend on how big the refugium is & how much flow goes through the sump.

Of course a 1500ltr flowrate over a 5" wide refugium won't do anything to the water.

But a 400ltr flowrate going through a 3ft or 4ft stretch of refugium should show some difference.(not in immediate NO3 levels etc, just the amount of skimmate)

The end result for pornstar would depend on his preference and really how much space in the sump to mess around with.

Although the only skimmers that i can think off that allow serial connection is the azoo/jebo ($40 type)....

just have to wait & see what kind of results happen as everything is different(skimmers,sump,refugium,return pump/flowrate).

pornstar, update us will ya on which pattern works best.

[PornStar]

I don't want to seem to be stating the obvious but I suppose that having more skimmers in a system would remove more gunk, with the underlying assumption that the skimmers are working at almost 100% efficiency each.

If not, the amount of gunk removed would only be as best as it's most efficient skimmer in the system? Right?

confused

[PornStar]

What i see is only in my tank because so far i'm the only one running it that way.

but 1 in a million is not conclusive. there are other factors like my bigger refugium footprint & lower flow through the sump.(which totals not more than 800ltrs/h)

Its my personal sump experiment for this year. most probably add in a few tweaks & rebuild a new one next yr based on the present results.

The example is for pornstar to play around with & try because he will be using 2 identical skimmers and the results would be better if he ran in parallel instead of serial.(parallel allows more volume to be skimmed)

that also does depend on how big the refugium is & how much flow goes through the sump.

Of course a 1500ltr flowrate over a 5" wide refugium won't do anything to the water.

But a 400ltr flowrate going through a 3ft or 4ft stretch of refugium should show some difference.(not in immediate NO3 levels etc, just the amount of skimmate)

The end result for pornstar would depend on his preference and really how much space in the sump to mess around with.

Although the only skimmers that i can think off that allow serial connection is the azoo/jebo ($40 type)....

just have to wait & see what kind of results happen as everything is different(skimmers,sump,refugium,return pump/flowrate).

pornstar, update us will ya on which pattern works best.

I will update once I get my tank running again when I move it to it's new location.

Will redo my whole setup by then.

Interesting situation.