Coral For Sale

[spicyball]

I don't it's fair at all for u all to impose your own values on other people. Of cause there is no problem in expressing them, but why must u all create such a din and try to make things so difficult for him?

[Shark]

your avatar damn scary..

it made me think twice about scuba diving again . ..

[Shark]

I don't it's fair at all for u all to impose your own values on other people. Of cause there is no problem in expressing them, but why must u all create such a din and try to make things so difficult for him?

making it difficult for who ? ?? ? ?

[spicyball]

oops.. day loh

[sphinx]

I think most of us do not not bother to check if the coral are from Cites approve sources as we can't verify that and being the owner of this forum definately cannot be responsible for forumer buying from which lfs as we can't even ascetain if their stock is cites cleared

However with this forum, it is helping ppl to learn more about this hobby and with knowledge from this forum, corals bought could thrive in the rite condition and once a hobbyist's tank is full of corals.. do you think he will be able to buy more?? I'm not saying my tank is in optimum condition, but i do choose corals that i can sustain in my tank and frankly i have to really consider real hard even i see a nice piece of coral that i would like to be in my tank, which more often than not it's not in my tank as it's full tank liao

I would like to thank AT to provide this forum for hobbyist to learn more about this hobby and help most but not all to do things right the first time rather than trial and error like me in those early days.

[Ricordia]

Still debating?????

For those who are interested to know more about CITES, please refer

http://www.cites.org/eng/disc/what.shtml

For those who are keen to know about buying propagated corals Vs CITES act,

please refer

http://www.cites.org/eng/cttee/animals/16/16-12-2.pdf

[pacificbetta]

These are also my final words in this thread, have to get some work done .

This is my stand, and I am expressing it my way. Please read carefully, I am not going to repeat myself as have been done over and over again.

1. The whole thing started when someone posted some corals for sale. Told to stop, he made up a webpage to sell the same corals, and posted a link in this forum.

2. My stand against his snails is based on the presumption that it is financing his collection activities, since our dear sir refused to stop his activities.

3. My stand against the snails, is also that it is clearly commercial harvesting under the pretense of home culture.

4. Whether my commercial operations suffer significantly due to his actions is up for all to judge.

5. Since half the forum already knows who I am before the first post, it is so very obvious that I painted a BIG target board on myself when I made the first post. The "unwelcome" post merely made it bigger, and probably also in red paint. Why I choose to do it is up to you to imagine and speculate.

6. My terms within my shop premises are very simple. I encourage conscientious reefing/fishing. If the transaction was conducted and concluded before you are made aware of this thread, I have nothing against you if you do not support such activities again. If the transaction was not concluded before you are aware of this thread, then I will appreciate it if you cancel that transaction. A public cancellation will be very nice. Unless you come up with a very good excuse, I am only interested in the result: "Is the purchase off or not?" I do not accept reasonings by alvy, ngh and unfortunately the latest by Ming. Another acceptable conclusion will be that someone ceased all commercial collections of corals, both in this forum and in his webpage, in which case I will also rescind my words. The only other conclusion will be that someone certifies that all his wildcolleciton is off the St John's reefs which are due for complete destuction anyway in a couple of years time. (The final conclusion though is again very controversial and may come with uncorrelated repercusions from other parties )

I am sorry all the buyers were dragged into this catfight, but I clasify that as collateral damage. Too bad I always see collateral damage as regretable but acceptable.

7. What is unwelcome? I will not physically throw you out of the shop. Unneccessary violence is against my conduct. But if I know who you are, or if you take the trouble to ID yourself to the guy in charge of purchasing (he is normally around on weekends), I promise a totally unique shopping experience.

8. I could appear very harsh and imposing to many, but I could have been a lot nastier. I merely believe peer pressure works better, too bad I see a need to actively "encourage" it.

9. And to admin: I am sorry to have to put commercial muscle into this forum. Right now, I see myself as a hobbyist who managed to convince some lousy management to support my cause

10. To the rest, admit it, this catfight had been highly entertaining and worthy of taking up a prime time slot right?

[Chris]

I suggest we rid the board of ALL sale of livestock. We are hobbyist and there are plenty of LFS that specialize in selling.

When the buying stop, the selling will and the killing will!!

Keep this website for discussion purpose and trading only in 2nd hand hardware.

This way, we need not venture into police-ing and contant suspicion on 'harvested' VS 'cultured' frags or corals!!

Just more opinion.

[piero]

Agreed. Even if there is any confusion, we can leave it to the relevant authority to deal with it. Either the AVA or PPD or Police or whatever. They will know what is legal, what is illegal when they pay a visit to the shop or house that the person is operating in. If all conscious is clear, no need to debate at all.

[Achilles Tang]

I suggest we rid the board of ALL sale of livestock.  We are hobbyist and there are plenty of LFS that specialize in selling.

When the buying stop, the selling will and the killing will!!

Err... the two statements don't seem to match.

Keep this website for discussion purpose and trading only in 2nd hand hardware.

This way, we need not venture into police-ing and contant suspicion on 'harvested' VS 'cultured' frags or corals!!

It's pretty obvious when a hobbyist suddenly has 'a lot of livestock' to clear and determine if it's because he has to make room for new stock, or wants to frag his corals to make more room etc vs another 'hobbyist' who acquired 'harvested' corals and are selling them for commercial gain.

To discourage the trading of corals between hobbyists is a little too much and doesn't serve any real purpose.

We encourage the propagation of corals in our tanks because , who knows, one day, idealistically, we may reach a day where hobbyists may one day be asked to donate species back into our seas and oceans to replenish stocks or perhaps even ceasing to buy livestock from the wild because our corals have adapted well to tank conditions and propagating fast enough to meet supply (in an ideal situation where all sought-after corals are well kept by ALL aquarist)

Therefore, all livestock from hobbyists tanks that have been kept for some time, will still be allowed to be sold or traded amongst fellow SRC members using the forum. Same goes for approved DIY projects or sale of 2nd hand/unused equipment of reasonable quantity.

Commercial sales will NOT be allowed unless carried out by SRC official sponsors.

[Linabbw]

*Unconstructive remark* Edited September 20, 2003 by Tanzy

[SharkBait]

Is this guy for real?

[Chris]

Sounds funny

[SpiderOne]

Oh Trust me..... i Know sarcasm when i see it.. . And he is trying to compete with me . YOU CANT WIN SWEETIE!!!!!

[DaY]

Linabbw Posted: Sep 20 2003, 01:00 AM 

*Edited for stupid content*.

erh?who are you and when u order from me?i never recieved any pm or watever from u b4 leh?..i see two post only from you..hmm..i think you must be someone who create a account out delibrating. Lol..

and when i starting to sell seawater?..ha.

[metals99]

come on lets forgive and forget.. :>

[Rufff]

Me think this is now getting a bit weird ... dun U think???

[piero]

Anyway I don't know why there seems to be double standards applied here... I think there is someone importing and selling ricordia somewhere in this forum too. How come the rules applied are different? Correct me if I am wrong here. I just find it kind of wierd.

[Shark]

Anyway I don't know why there seems to be double standards applied here... I think there is someone importing and selling ricordia somewhere in this forum too. How come the rules applied are different? Correct me if I am wrong here. I just find it kind of wierd.

Finally someone on the same frequency " power 98.0 ! "

This is what i had posted eariler

===================================================

Anyway any transcation be it a piece or two is also of commercial purpose so why the fuzz at Day and only Day ? Why would propagating and selling afew batches over months be not commercial .. . .

===================================================

"Commercial" is the key word but why ? as highlighted PIERO too

[Shark]

Hi

would like to cancel my order of 3 snail and 2 sea lettuce,I hope that I am not banned from visit your lfs shop .I sorry that I have to cancel the order from you (day) because your snail and lettuce are no cites.Oh yes ,also the 2 bucket of seawater i want to cancel also because they no have the cites.

I have to say that the LFS owner intergirty better because he say about the commercial interest and not the cites ,He also got power and muscle to ban many people from his shop,If we all not careful next time all member here all ban.

That why I cancel my order , I hope I can visit his shop ,becuase he got many knowledge and equipment. nothing he keep die in his hand before.He also honest because he say he own a lfs , but i think Day dont.I also feel scared because I think he is sponser.

I very sad today because i kena ban and cannot sleep.Rickcoredia I have to let yo0u know I don want order from you ,wait I get ban from lfs owner.Hope you understanding.

Thanks

Sounds like someone without a back bone . . .

must be invert .. .

SLUT i would reckon

dang lame !

[piero]

Add on to my previous post: - Cos the other side also doing as big a business if not bigger...

[DaY]

i just hear that PR has new stock ricordea to sell( but half of them are dead?or so i hear today)..I guess someone would try to target and stop other people selling ricordea in here pretty soon already...then he would say come up with the same excuses saying the ricordea are without cities...etc etc. No wonder he trying to stop people from selling so call "corals without cities" in here.

[DaY]

piero Posted on Sep 20 2003, 03:35 PM

  Anyway I don't know why there seems to be double standards applied here... I think there is someone importing and selling ricordia somewhere in this forum too. How come the rules applied are different? Correct me if I am wrong here. I just find it kind of wierd. 

Shark Posted on Sep 20 2003, 04:00 PM

===================================================

Anyway any transcation be it a piece or two is also of commercial purpose so why the fuzz at Day and only Day ? Why would propagating and selling afew batches over months be not commercial .. . .

I just happen to be the first guniea pig to be operate on..

i guess there would be others guniea pigs later on.

[SpiderOne]

I think the gist is you selling stuff for commercial gain which is just plain against the forum policy.

Theres a difference between propagating YOUR OWN .corals to sell and picking them from malaysia to come back and sell here as u told me in IRC

oh yea just remembered. not u pick yourself your friends pick for u . did i remember wrongly? sorry bad memory

Edited September 20, 2003 by SpiderOne

[DaY]

Then why am i seeing someone in the queue for ricordea also?

30. SpiderOne (2pc) 90041042.

Isn't it the same? except that ricordea is getting his ricordea from bali. He not propagating the ricordea also mah.

Or are you just plain picking on me

Dun call the kettle black if u are buying stuffs also.