What say you abt the article in Sunday TimesPg8

[prec]

yea.. we got so many pros here.. we have the tanks, not to mention tank of the month in RC also, we have the knowledge and we have the proof in full color pictures.. hahaha..

[djviper]

15 pple are taking care of the tank !

[Achilles Tang]

Read this!

[prec]

Hmmm.. so its been around since last year.. but just tt they made a bigger woo har in src this time rd with their newspaper articles..

[Achilles Tang]

Why is the skimmed water RED in colour?!

[shoelevy]

i've written a response in to straits times

don't worry mods, i didn't mention SRC's involvement just incase.

i'm going to write my response for you guys to read and hopefully comment on it.

PLS DON"T FLAME ME!

i just want straits times to know our views

here it is

Dear Sir,

I am writing with regards to an article i came across in today's straits times dated 6th March 2005 on page 8 regarding a new solution to changing water problems.

I am a marine hobbyist with experience of about half year and have read extensively for another few months before i started on this hobby.

I have discussed with my friends with years of experiencein this hobby about this article.

Our views have triggered sending this email to you.

Before i continue, let me first say that we do not mean to insult/offend anyone but would like to enlighten you to certain facts and mistakes in the article.

1st of all, the article claims that the students developed a new way of filtrating the water and that is to make use of bioballs and bio-rings to allow bacteria that converts ammonia to nitrite then to nitrate flourish. While i agree that this is the way most hobbyists deal with ammonia in the system, i DO NOT agree with the fact that this form of filtration is new. This form of filtration was already employed by the Germans at least a few years or even a decade ago. Their method is called the Berlin filtration system. The only difference between the German's system and that of the students is that the Germans use liverocks for the bacteria to grow on instead of using bioballs as the students did. However, the berlin system requires alot of liverocks which is expensive to acquire, as such, the bioballs method has already been developed by less wealthy hobbyists locally and abroad.Pay a visit to any reputable fresh or marine fish shop and you should see this method already employed on their display tanks. Hence, it is definitely wrong to say the students developed it because technically, thousands of hobbyists already use this method and it is not new.

Next, if the photo featured in the newspaper shows the fish tank that the students developed and they claim the water in that tank is already a year old not requiring the slightest water change, then let me explain to you why they have been successful.

(For this next part, i assume nitrates are not gotten rid of since it was not mentioned in the article.)

The system that the students employed removes ammonia and the end result is nitrate. As time passes, ammonia constantly generated from leftover fish food rotting and fish urine will be converted to nitrates by the bacteria and lead to a build up in nitrate. There are methods of removing nitrates from the aquarium but i assume the system is incapable of removing nitrates as it was not mentioned in the article. Under such a system, not changing water for a year means nitrates have built up to tremondous amounts, usually in the order of 80-100ppm.

From the photo, i see clownfishes, a huge clam, and a few leather corals.

1)The reason why they are successful is because fishes can tolerate high nitrates,

2) clams need nitrates to survive and

3) leather corals are soft corals (soft corals in general are very tough and can withstand nitrates)

Had they been keeping hard corals like lps and sps, they would definitely NOT have been successful with not changing water a year. The reason is because hard corals require water that contain less than 10ppm of nitrates to flourish. With the system the students use, hard corals would most certainly have either perished or be extremely unhealthy.

What i am trying to say here is the article should have mentioned not having change water for a year is only acceptable IF:

the hobbyist intends to keep ONLY fishes and soft corals(even i would not recmomend soft corals under such extreme nitrate conditions) and not sensitive corals like sps and lps. With such high nitrates, even invertebrates such as snails and shrimps and star fishes would perish.

The article should also have mentioned that:

1) if the hobbyist intends to be successful with more sensitive creaturess, then he must employ methods to get rid of nitrates.(one of the methods IS WATER CHANGE on a regular basis)

2)nuisance algae flourishes when high nitrates are present which explains the greenish hue seen on the rocks in the photo

THESE CRUCIAL POINTS should have been mentioned. Imagine readers after seeing this article thinks that marine tanks are easy and rush to buy the setup, putting in lps,sps,shrimps and starfishes only to find that a few months later, all but their fishes are dead and their tank is overwhelmed with nuisance algae!

Such a grave failure on part of the reader is undesireable as it only fuels the hobbyist to buy more corals to "try try" only to find that he is unsuccessful. He has not only wasted his money but precious coral lives.

Marine creatures as of this moment are all harvested from the wild, such a grave failure on part of the reader is undesireable as it only fuels the hobbyist to buy more corals, causing higher demand and thus more destruction of coral reefs during harvesting for the corals.

Whether I have made a mistake by assuming that nitrate reduction methods were employed by the students and Coral Reef Aquarium, who is incharge or manufacturing the system developed by the students, i do not know. But what i do know is straits times shouldn't have been careless in:

1)omitting nitate reduction techniques employed by the students if they were indeed employed

2)if the methods were not employed, straits times should have cautioned enthusiasts against sensitive coral specimens by explaining that even nitrates, even though less toxic, if allowed to climb to high levels over time can be toxic as well.

Thank you for taking time to read this

Yours,

Mr Wong

[prec]

the fishes are bleeding?!!!

[Achilles Tang]

Shoelevy... hats off to you!

That's what I call a passionate reefer!

AT

[shoelevy]

Shoelevy... hats off to you!

That's what I call a passionate reefer!

AT

thanks AT,

i was at first unsure of what i did but seeing that you approve of it, i'm glad i did it

thanks AT!

[bubble_gum]

i think this would get them back to reality...

[shoelevy]

psst guys, would my comments bring me a law suit from straits time ah???

haha

[prec]

wont la.. good job!!

[steven]

shoelevy,

nice piece of article.

when my dad show me the newspaper, i was thinking

1) The methods are nothing new.

2) There is a need for someone to clarify/ correct them. ppl would think that marine fishes, corals are so easy to keep without proper filtration and in the end... lot of fishes and corals would be lost....

Just to share my thoughts....

Save the marine fishes, corals !!!!

[akahoshi]

You go man!!! Hehee, finally got someone voice out for us

hmm... one slight thing that i think you should change from your letter..

Ok, i copied and pasted this portion from the letter..

From the photo, i see clownfishes, a huge clam, and a few leather corals.

1)The reason why they are successful is because fishes can tolerate high nitrates,

2) clams need nitrates to survive and

3) leather corals are soft corals (soft corals in general are very tough and can withstand nitrates)

Hmm.. on the first point hor, i think your put "The reason why they are successful is beacuse THE FISHES THEY ARE KEEPING can tolerate high nitrates"

Coz, if other people read, they will think any fish can tolerate high nitrates...

Just my thought, might coz a super minor misunderstanding..

[blueheaven]

Just read the article and here are my views.

Firstly, we do not know the background of this maritime law lecturer and whether he is a hobbyist. And like what many have said, his revolutionary method of filtration using bacteria is actually a copy from the methods we know of now. I still can't believe that 15 students are working on this project with new intakes every year. They make it sound like a new poly course .

Anyway, you can see in the picture that the tank has so many clownfish and soft corals with a stressed squamosa. Yes, the water can be clean and clear but do they care about the LS? And they say that the method works when the bacteria converts ammonia into nitrates and then it stops there. Do they even bother to remove the nitrates?

And if the lecturer and his students think that their revolutionary setup is like top notch, the're probably going to faint when they see some of the TOTM winners here. And to think that they collaborated with a company to mass produce this system with sales over 4 million. Just imagine the number of people wasting their money adopting this method when they can easily replicate it using low cost stuff.

And what shocked me is that the lecturer said that it is nonsensical to buy expensive devices to maintain water quality and check the parameters and he explains a whole lot of crap about pH going down...blah blah blah. Hey there's lots more to it than pH bro.

And the most controversial and ambiguous issue is that he did not mention the water parameters of the tank running on his system. How then, do we know that the system is efficient? By just looking at the water?

I really hope this guy is informed of our club here and would come share his views. Anyone studying in SP mind to tell him of our existence?

[djviper]

ur the man shoelevy ! way to go...

hee maybe straits times might ask u to write an article on marine fishes than ur gonna be famous

cheers

[prec]

maybe shoelevy can write in to ST again to make known our existence?

[barnacle]

shoelevy

[LaW]

shoelevy~ shoelevy|~

ur saluted

[livebait]

How does the sales reached 4.5 million dollars? 

There must be someone from the research team in this forum rite? Give more information leh.

Imagine readers after seeing this article thinks that marine tanks are easy and rush to buy the setup

that's how

[shoelevy]

ur the man shoelevy ! way to go...

hee maybe straits times might ask u to write an article on marine fishes than ur gonna be famous

cheers

WA!!

不敢不敢。。。if they wanna ask someone to write article they should as Danano, weileong, AT, deepblue, scarab and the likes of these people

if i write, probably write all the wrong things and kanah kick out of this forum

hahaha

hm..on 2nd thoughts, maybe i ask some guru write and i steal all the credits for it

[shoelevy]

maybe shoelevy can write in to ST again to make known our existence?

in my opinion no use really, because they reporters are not hobbyists, at most they'll just come "see see" our forum

they won't realise how wrong they and SP are

neither will they realise how complex, tough and beautiful this hobby is and not to mention the money and discipline you have to display (i admit i've been lacking in these areas but i'm trying my best!)

they'll probably shrug us off as hardcore la, siao la, and what have you

besides, its such a small article, they'll give much more attention to people who feedback on say palestinian/isreali issues

worse ah!....if they decide to take revenge for whatever reason la...they know we all at SRC!!!

better not get SRC involved...one person die better than 3000+ people in this forum ya?

hope u understand my reasons for not mentioning SRC

[shoelevy]

hey, any other guys wrote in to straits times?

[djviper]

yeah i understand why u post ur article ... just don't want people to start a marine tank and give up, cuz their fishes/corals keep dieing....

[Achilles Tang]

We hobbyists who are in the know will know the truth.

Some who stand by what they think is their truth will attempt to bring down what others disagree as their truth.

I know the forces in question has tried to silence the truth from being brought to light.

I strongly recommend making personal comments against the character of the person(s) in question. Comments about the method... by all means!

In the past, one SRC member who was/is in the faculty was severely warned about speaking against him/them/their claims.

Responsible reefkeeping is what we preach and we should speak up against the fallacy of this method.

I hope any newbies to this hobby will learn better tank setup methods here and certainly try not change water for a year just because one person said so against general knowledge.

AT