The comet's 5 footer!!!

[Melvyn Tan]

Ekia, for your method it is possible when you have seeded rocks + matured stuffs. Again quantity dependant, which is why setup by lfs to owners who can't wait need only a matter of days before stocking-up. Still i think there will be some detectable Ammonia + Nitrite although not dangerous levels.

[Tigger]

Your tank is too big. It will take few weeks for ammonia to reach detectable limits. I have the same problem as my tank is 4 feet with 2 feet sump. When ammonia reading is detectable, it just spike!

[aStRoBo|]

Your tank is too big. It will take few weeks for ammonia to reach detectable limits. I have the same problem as my tank is 4 feet with 2 feet sump. When ammonia reading is detectable, it just spike!

hMm.. for my 2feet.. no matter how much market prawns i throw in, ammonia still safe.. nitrite still minimal. I using seeded LRs. cycle finished on day 9.

[shoelevy]

ok

will take into account fact tt rocks were mature and tank is big

will continue testing over this long hol period.

if both still 0 by the end of 10days...i'll assume its complete

[shoelevy]

Wow its really a phenomenon ! but surely the decomposition from nitrogenous waste - protein - amino acid (phenol) - amine [Mineralisation Stage] takes a while ? Maybe you wanna check your pH, if the Heterotrophic Bacteria is working, the conversation from Amine to Ammonia + Organic Acid will reduce the pH.

Whats your quantity of LR involved?

For aquarium without LR (or dead rocks) the Ammonia will kick in only after day 4 and peaked on day 8-9.

For aquarium with LR (quantity dependant) Nitrate production will start in day 1 and you should see a spike in Ammonia in day 4 and some Nitrite readings also (peaked in day 13-15), approx. day 16 the Nitrate will be rocket high.

Importantly, tank size and quantity/size of dead prawn ratio to kick start the ANN is also a factor.

Guideline for maturation time : -

Aquarium set-up with "seeded" live rock + "seeded" live sand filter (natural system) - about 3 - 10 days

Aquarium set-up with an "unseeded" sub-sand filter and "seeded" live rock - about 14 to 28 days

Hope this helps...

50kg out of 70kg of rocks i use is lr

[shoelevy]

jus did a test on nitrates frmo the tank...its at 20ppm

jus for comparision...i tested my tap water and its 5ppm.

i suppose this increase is due to the cycling?

[Ancelot]

Just ask for some black skimmate from beckett users then pour all in confirm get your cycling started And probably won't get those terrible smell from the rotting prawn

IMO i find this action stupid. Cause think about it.. if we are going to pour skimmate into our own tank arent we making whats going to be worst even MUCH more worst? whats the sole purpose of a skimmer? Removing proteins and other organic wastes so that our marine invertebrates and other critters can thrive right? So what will happen if we pour our skimmate back? We are surely going to kill alot of beneficial bacteria! and YES! you have a BIG ammonia spike but your tank will have a hard time coming back to live again! and what a waste of money investing in those good live rocks..

Weileong dude, I am not opposing your views i know you are joking but its hard to guarantee that there will be someone who read this liao really go and do it cause afterall, you got a great tank and all the experience yeah? so people tend to believe you and will go do that, well.. there goes another prospective reefer..

Just my 2 cents worth..

[Ancelot]

i know thats what i mean!

[shoelevy]

ya lo...both will gif ammonia spike which is ultimately wat we want in cycling the tank rite?

[Ekia]

IMO i find this action stupid. Cause think about it.. if we are going to pour skimmate into our own tank arent we making whats going to be worst even MUCH more worst? whats the sole purpose of a skimmer? Removing proteins and other organic wastes so that our marine invertebrates and other critters can thrive right? So what will happen if we pour our skimmate back? We are surely going to kill alot of beneficial bacteria! and YES! you have a BIG ammonia spike but your tank will have a hard time coming back to live again! and what a waste of money investing in those good live rocks..

Weileong dude, I am not opposing your views i know you are joking but its hard to guarantee that there will be someone who read this liao really go and do it cause afterall, you got a great tank and all the experience yeah? so people tend to believe you and will go do that, well.. there goes another prospective reefer..

Just my 2 cents worth..

Skimmate should be able to start the cycle as well... although if u have LRs in the tank... its rather unnecessary... but i dun find anything wrong with it.. the main purpose of starting the cycle is to build up the beneficial bacteria... so getting the skimmate in will actually build up the beneficial bacteria

[weileong]

IMO i find this action stupid. Cause think about it.. if we are going to pour skimmate into our own tank arent we making whats going to be worst even MUCH more worst? whats the sole purpose of a skimmer? Removing proteins and other organic wastes so that our marine invertebrates and other critters can thrive right? So what will happen if we pour our skimmate back? We are surely going to kill alot of beneficial bacteria! and YES! you have a BIG ammonia spike but your tank will have a hard time coming back to live again! and what a waste of money investing in those good live rocks..

Weileong dude, I am not opposing your views i know you are joking but its hard to guarantee that there will be someone who read this liao really go and do it cause afterall, you got a great tank and all the experience yeah? so people tend to believe you and will go do that, well.. there goes another prospective reefer..

Just my 2 cents worth.. 

Hey bro.... I know you must be still very high from your ($320 - $20*2) corals.

Do read the whole thread properly, aStRoBo| is asking on how to kick start his ANN cycle. If pouring thick black skimmate into the tank is like what you mentioned is stupid, then throwing in a prawn to let it rot is as stupid if not worst as you still have to bear with the smell from the rotting prawn. Are you telling me that anyone who advise reefers to throw in prawn to kick start the cycle are giving wrong advise as well? Or even better our boss here AT who throw in a big Sotong into this tank to kick start the cycle is also giving stupid comments?

[blueheaven]

Cool bro weileong....

Lets get back to the topic, you can settle it with bro Ancelot privately

[aStRoBo|]

aWw.. im involved.. this not my thread leh.. but either way, skimate or prawn, even urine will work. so no hard feelings for the both bros..

[lightningstrike]

IMO i find this action stupid. Cause think about it.. if we are going to pour skimmate into our own tank arent we making whats going to be worst even MUCH more worst?

i dun find using skimmate to kick off ANN cycle sounds stupid. the worst it can get is that u get an ammonia spike which is what aStRoBo| wants in order to kick start the cycle.

whats the sole purpose of a skimmer? Removing proteins and other organic wastes so that our marine invertebrates and other critters can thrive right? So what will happen if we pour our skimmate back? We are surely going to kill alot of beneficial bacteria! and YES! you have a BIG ammonia spike but your tank will have a hard time coming back to live again! and what a waste of money investing in those good live rocks..

the purpose of skimming really comes into effect after the ANN cycle to remove whatever DOC........ leaving beneficial bacterial to grow and colonise on the sand / LRs and do what it is suppose to do. no LS will be in the tank during the ANN cycle. so there is no cause for worry.

[blueheaven]

FYI, in regards to sandbeds, the autotrophic aerobic bacteria at the top layer actually consumes DOC and the byproduct is utilised by the heterotrophic anareobic bacteria

[rustee]

FYI, in regards to sandbeds, the autotrophic aerobic bacteria at the top layer actually consumes DOC and the byproduct is utilised by the heterotrophic anareobic bacteria

Dont autotrophic bacteria synthesize their own food (organic molecules) from simple raw materials such as inorganic compunds like inorganic nitrogen? why do they actually consume DOC?

[shoelevy]

brothers...i don't mean to be rude but this is supposed to be a thread i use to update people on my tank setup...occasionally we can veer for a while to make the thread interested but the bact and skim mate thing is going TOOO

STOP!!!

better sae sth to bring the back....hm....ph drop from 8.3 to 8.1

any comments?

[Melvyn Tan]

pH droped is a good sign - like i said there are (organic) acid which is produced as a result from the conversion from anime to ammonia + organic acid, a sign that the heterotrophic bacteria is working. OMEDETOO GOZAIMASU ! You should be able to detect some ammonia now.

[blueheaven]

Yeah sorry, I made a mistake, guess i was too tired

The bacteria that breaks organic compounds are the aerobic heterotrophs

Now back to shoelevy's tank

[shoelevy]

pH droped is a good sign - like i said there are (organic) acid which is produced as a result from the conversion from anime to ammonia + organic acid, a sign that the heterotrophic bacteria is working. OMEDETOO GOZAIMASU ! You should be able to detect some ammonia now.

nope...not a trace of ammonia

u know y?

[blueheaven]

I don't think using 1 prawn is enough to produce ammonia to much of an extent

The ammonia is probably diluted in such a large water volume.

Maybe try 3-4 prawns?

[shoelevy]

if so then if i add fishes now...there should be no prob rite? since one prawn can't even produce nh3 spike...then a few fishes also can't

then slowly...i increase bio load...and nh3 production increase but since its a slow and gradual addition...so bact can at the same time reproduce slowly to cope with the increase of nh3

am i rite?

[Melvyn Tan]

How many days already?

[shoelevy]

coming to 5daes

wat i said above is jus a quest to clear up concept of cycling up...i don't intend to add any fish

[RAV-65]

Juz a word of advice bro, why not replace the pile of newspapers under your skimmer with bricks?? much more stable and also, the newspaper are a calamity waiting to happen if it gets wet...

Also, u might wanna get a 1.5L bottle as a collection bottle as the one u r using abit small, sometimes when you dose certain medication, the skimmer can go crazy, so allow more storage space!

Anyway, agree with you using rowas, seems like everyone forgot the rowas absorbs silicates as well, this will reduce the possibilty of a huge diatoms problem or cyano in the future!

Nice thread.. keep it up!! Cant wait to see more pics!