For AT and moderators.

[arcanehacker]

More related stuff:

http://www.sgreefclub.com/forum/index.php?...=0entry161251

[maKo]

Publishing personal details is an equally irresponsible act, amounting to a breach of trust. Sometimes "an eye for an eye" is not the best solution. Society would go a step backwards if people report on each other the same way things were done during the Cultural Revolution. I think nicee has probably already learned his lesson from reading all our posts, and if he still doesn't, he'll soon meet his match one day. Meanwhile, let the buyer/seller beware..

[arcanehacker]

Ok lets get this straight here.. we are recommending Blacklisting nicks not publishing personal details.. that "pilot" can aeroplane and create new usernames all he/she wants.. it a matter of time he/she gives up.. unless he starts anew totally with a new nick..

[jesperlam]

well.. have me fair share of ppl who send me on a plane ride to Holland... but i guess this is the real world we dealing here... not all reefers or should i say buyers have honest intentions.. guess no matter where we go.. there will also be this bunch of black sheep who will spoil it for the rest of us...

posting their names and mobiles also dont help very much... that also can change one... maybe next time get them to pay a deposit first... and if they dont turn up to get it.. then at least you have the deposit....

I'll go with Benz with the desposit system as i feel the one that lose out will be the "pilot" rather than the seller. Maybe a 10-15% deposit is good enough. And the seller can pocket the deposit and the item can still be sold to another more trusting party.

The blacklisting will be good as a reference to the seller to take note about those "pilots". It will come in handy!

So "pilot" out there be prepared for a crash with ur "aeroplane"!

Btw, i'm also quite a new reefer!

[roidan]

hmm..let the buyer/seller beware...

in that case the buyer sell to/entertain potential sellers he trust and the sellers buy from buyers they trust...

if any problems crops up, can only blame their own bad sense of judgement right? cannot blame the other fellow for vanishing...

most are pretty responsible, just like some said, only a few black sheep causing such inconvenience...

imagine when a bro taking public transport, going across half the island and then genna a no-show? this kind of frustration very hard for those who never/seldom encounter it to understand....

i genna early back those days when i dun have my own transport, the agony really can make me ....but nowadays, as a seller, i make arrangements in a way that if the buyer aeroplane, will not affect me or my schedule much....

then at least just carry on with the day's plans and not feel so

[arcanehacker]

deposit system is not gonna work in any forum.. first place there is usually no trust in both parties. And it IS NOT recommended to pay up first be it deposit or full.. & if there is trust (usually would be some friends or know each other well), then there wouldn't be a need for deposit.

Secondly its really fussy as there is a need for a transaction for a deposit.

[Acanthurus pyroferus]

unfortunately there are alot of these people around but I've learned to identify the ones that are true when it comes to sales of items. Just give them a day to purchase and if they ask too many questions about the product cut them off and lable them as unsure and not sincere to buy. I use that rule when selling stuff like my 4ft PL lights that are on the pasar mamalam thread. I wouldn't like to mention names but there were two request with alot of questions about the lights which were unnecessary and it gave me a clue as to how serious these people were...just my observation..... Bro Joe....is facing some pretty tough problems with irresponsible buyers that have gone MIA....

[Siput]

Bro Acanthurus pyroferus, to be fair the buyer has a right to ask questions, as the pdt may or may not meet his/her specs. But tend to agree buyers/sellers have a responsibility to see the deal through once they agree to buy/sell...

[Acanthurus pyroferus]

I do agree of course about questions but a whole day of asking is quite a bit don't you think. Basically , there isn't much to tell about a product once a buyer has asked the necessary details. I don't know about others but that gives me an indication already how serious the person is in the purchase.... For example , I have sold some items before after reserving more then 2 days of questioning and interrogation .... that I had to go through and finally there were no response or even a hint of an sms. Where else , I had to put off interested and genuine buyers who were willing to come and pick it up straight away after knowing the price. Can you see the difference in that? Marine equipment is not new to us and we know the basics functions of a certain item we're interested already before purchasing....

[Siput]

Agreed!

[patgohch]

Basically, all we're saying now is, be your own responsible buyer/seller.

Be grateful that we have a space (Pasar Malam) to trade our stuffs, for our convenience. That should be as far as we should go for this forum that was set up for higher purposes....

Let's move on...before the moderators decide to remove the "pasar Malam" section altogether if it's creating so much problems...

[marcvelous]

All fellow reefing bros and sistas,

All this talk of complain and retaliation is a reckless act.

I never fly others aeroplane (reefers whom I bought from can testisfy to this) but have had my share of flights.

As bawater aptly put

The pasar malam serves as a platform for hobbyist to trade or to sell off unwanted items- as such the deals or agreements are made between individual parties be it privately by PM or in the open forum.

SRC cannot bear the responsibility of every single sale posted by members. We do remove commercial post ASAP.

i'm sure there are others waiting in line to get the item if you repost that the item is still available.

It is unfair to ban or warn him due to a private deal gone wrong between 2 members.

It is the responsibility of the buyer and seller to complete the transaction .

The question I think all the proponents of the "banning/complaining/aeroplane" corner missed a very important point: Who will be the judge/arbitrator in these disputes?

Do we set up a tribunal? Or a committee of judges? Do we hear both sides of the story before any judgement, possibily including some form of penalty, is passed? How do we authenicate the stories? Call into witness the passengers of public transport? Or go by the mileage meter on your vehicle?

And ultimately, if these people are as irresponsible as claimed, what is there to stop them from lodging complaints against responsible reefers just for kicks?! Or worse still, vengence? Remember, nicks can change, as are handphones numbers, addresses (IP or residential), names and etc.

Remember that any weapon that can hurt others also have the potential to harm the weilder. Let's not be too rash in building any.

Just my humble opinions.

[maKo]

I don't see how deposits can be collected when you travel halfway across the island and the payer doesn't turn up..

[aStRoBo|]

Ok lets get this straight here.. we are recommending Blacklisting nicks not publishing personal details.. that "pilot" can aeroplane and create new usernames all he/she wants.. it a matter of time he/she gives up.. unless he starts anew totally with a new nick..

Ya, i just intend the mods to setup to monitor those irresponsible reefers. And NOT wanting to publish their contacts, name,address wadsoever. So pls ppl, don't make this a complicated issue. Thank you.

[fangtooth]

i know he is a fishy fella.

buying lions and selling at the same time

[arcanehacker]

Ya, i just intend the mods to setup to monitor those irresponsible reefers. And NOT wanting to publish their contacts, name,address wadsoever. So pls ppl, don't make this a complicated issue. Thank you.

true.. this is getting more and more complicated.. why does a simple issue become so complicated?! ..

just a matter of listing nicks here. See, now I know not to deal with nicee or at least becareful of him.. simple as that.

[Achilles Tang]

Hmmm.... in light of what's been discussed... IMHO...

I personally find 'flying aeroplane' extremely disgusting as it reflects a bad character flaw... COURTESY. In today's world, its extremely easy to reach out and communicate with someone... SMS, a phone call, a PM, an email etc. What's so hard to call someone who's waiting for you and say that you can't make it, or wish to postpone, or to tell him that he can release the item for sale because he changed his mind?

I don't advise naming someone's real name here. If it's just the nickname, it would be less humiliating.

Some people hide behind nicknames, but eventually, people will know who is who, unless the fella is a real recluse.

SG is so small, everyone will know someone who knows someone who knows you, if they don't know you already. Seriously, as a local community of reefers, word will spread very quickly via gossip or info exchange.

I hope everyone can learn to keep their nose clean. Just be a considerate human being.

I don't mind if you want to bring up to other people's attention that a reefer here is fond of 'flying aeroplane' but NOT till you yourself TRY all means and ways to get this fella to EXPLAIN himself to you why he did what he did. After a considerable amount of time has passed and he still didn't respond to you via sms, phone calls, pm or email... then by all means, catch his attention via a public posting.

Again, I must state, that SRC is not responsible for any consequences arising from this course of action.

You have to judge yourself if you have given ample opportunity for the other fella to explain himself to you.

I therefore urge all disgruntled reefers to resolve this out of sight as far as possible and let fellow SRC reefers know only as a last resort (more like a warning to be careful with dealings with that said person).

If your public posting to call out this fella results in an all out flame war... remember my policy about flaming too... don't become a victim of your own actions. I will NOT be merciful.

We are a small community, let's try to get along well with each other.

My 2 cents,

AT

[aStRoBo|]

So people, got AT boss words clearly. just becareful on the sales u doing next time. I have learnt a lesson.And i never ever had the intention to have Sgreef to be responsible, i'm responsible of what i done(what i done to deserved this?) Case closed. Sorry for inconvinence caused.