Should I be panicking now?

[lona]

Hi Everyone,

I've 7kg of rock in my tank already. The die-off from the rock started a n2 cycle already. The thing is, I haven't really cleaned all my sand. Would it be ok if I added clean sand a little everyday as the cycle is going on or should I wait till the end of the cycle? I'm going for a DSB, and at the moment I have about 2inches of sand already.

Next thing, the nh3 is at 0.2, no2 at 0.5, no3 at 2..so are these numbers expected? I'm not too sure..I only know they're supposed to be there..

Ok more unexpected problems, my pH dropped from 8.3 to 8..is that normal during cycling? Should I invest in a buffer?

Also, I noticed a starfish-like thing sticking to the side of my tank, except the bugger has 6 legs..is the fella good or bad? Attached is a picture..later on he unstuck himself and went to the rock.

AND, I saw this thing like a little green anemone. I read about this pest in another thread but I can't remember the name nor the chemical to treat it..so I can't search for the thread..I know you're supposed to squirt something on the bugger and he'll drop off..and I saw my first one..the rest of my rocks don't have this..what is it called and what's the treatment?

Should I be panicking now? Or am I doing things ok?

Please, somebody advise..

[Tanzy]

Why are you holding back on the sand? Add it all at once so it can develope the anoxic and anaerobic areas of the DSB. Adding a bit at a time will only delay the denitrification. Just chuck it all in until you get 4-6".

pH drop during cycling is normal due to increase decomposition and acid production. A water change will take care of it at the end of the cycle.

That's just a brittle star. Good to have.

Are you sure it's the majano anemone? If you are then squirt it with calcium hydroxide paste to kill it. It's best to do all these type of nonsense now before all the livestock goes in. No worries of anything going wrong.

Don't worry too much and let nature take it's course.

[pospeh]

I really don't suggest that anyone do in-tank cycling of LR.

The die off of the noxious organisms on the live rock can create quite a bit of deitrus that should preferably be removed. There is also the possiblity that the whole tank water might be fouled if your rock is really unclean.

Live rock purchased from LFS should always be cured first in a bucket with an airhose, unless you are absolutely sure that its been cured for some time. Not only it is easy to remove the accumulated deitrus, its also easier to remove the unwanted organisms before you place the LR in your tank's aquascaping.

[lona]

Hi Tanzy,

Hm..ok I'll speed up the sand addition..

One question though, why is it not good to add water during the cycle? Just curious, not that I'm planning to or anything..

I'm not sure about the name of the anemone though..I remember that I've to squirt the damn thing..it'll suck up all the paste and curl up and fall out. When I touched it just now it retracted into the hole. It's green in colour and its tips are white. If I remember correct it's the one where if I don't kill it and break it the pieces can regenerate. If it really is the majano anemone, where can I buy the kalkwasser please? And oh yeah, is it expensive? Do I have to panic and rush out to buy the paste or can relax a little and buy later in the week?

Thanks for the prompt reply tanzy, really appreciate it..

[Achilles Tang]

To add on further to cycling LR... it's not a problem if done in-tank.... you just need to get a very good skimmer to help remove all the gunk. Doing a partial water change after the cycling is complete would also be good.

[lona]

Hi again pospeh,

Ya I didn't directly put it into the tank, I left it in a separate pail of saltwater and directed a powerhead at it. Most of the dirt and dead have already fallen out. I think one of my rock has some dying sponge..it smells a little..but I figured since it doesn't smell THAT bad..the little ammonia should be good to start the cycle.

[lona]

Anyways,

This is a picture of my bare bare tank..

As you can see, the sand is still low at the moment..didn't want to put too much water in at the moment cos I figured the sand would displace the water..at any rate I could always add more water at the end of the cycle..

[pospeh]

Agreed, AT.

A good skimmer (i.e, ~$1000 w/ pump) will solve a heck of a lot of problems, and I consider it to be an essential piece of equipment, but 99% of the ppl starting out in this hobby are not going to get a $1000 skimmer. Their entire budget is less than that!!

Cycling in a bucket just makes things so much easier, simpler and more mistake-proof for a newbie.

[lona]

Hi,

Gee..$1000 plus..pospeh's right..way outta my budget. Anyways, I did what pospeh said..I chucked it into the pail and let it run for about 24hours..the smelly one I left it for 48hrs.

Oh and some of my rock seems to have a thin white film over some parts of it..issit good? bad? <_<

[pospeh]

Hi,

Gee..$1000 plus..pospeh's right..way outta my budget. Anyways, I did what pospeh said..I chucked it into the pail and let it run for about 24hours..the smelly one I left it for 48hrs.

Oh and some of my rock seems to have a thin white film over some parts of it..issit good? bad?

Lona,

24 or even 48 hours is not enough.

The LR should be left in the bucket for weeks until it is completely cured (i.e., clean smelling).

I know you don't plan to get any skimmers, so I suggest you to put the LR back in a bucket. Otherwise, you can treat your whole tank as a curing bucket and clean the 4-6 inches of sand later.

The white film, without looking at it, is probably decaying matter being digested by the bacteria. i.e, decaying sludge

If the film is hard and crusty, it may be coralline algae.

[Wei]

Hi lona,

i would suggest you just add all yr rocks & sand in to let everything cycle by itself. The excess detrius & nutrients will help in the process of cycling the tank.

Why is yr tank half filled only? U will need 2 more PH for yr circulation to prevent any dead spot in tank.

You can invest in a sander skimmer that is quite cheap but just dun buy orca. Within $120.

Wei

[lona]

Hi guys,

Pospeh> Actually I was thinking of doing what wei just suggested, the rock didn't smell too bad leh..that's why I thought it be ok to let it in to cycle.. ..hmm..I'll probably take a whiff of it tomorrow..if it smells worse I'll chuck it back into the pail.

Oh..the rock with the bad smell comes from just one place..the rest of the rock smells ok actually..that's why I figured it'd be ok. But I'll bear your warning in mind..thanks a bunch..

I think you're right about the decaying sludge..it's not crusty..it's like very thin egg white..you know..the half boiled kind?

Wei> I didn't want to buy too many lousy PH at the moment. My first one already seems like it's dying can you believe it? The output don't seem as strong as the first day I bought it..think I'll go looking for the maxijet ones already..

[lona]

Oh..could someone point me in the direction to get myself some kalkwasser? Do you know if it's expensive?

[Wei]

HI lona,

no matter how the rock smell, just add it in to help yr tank cycle. The sludge you mention can be food for the critters living in the sand & might encourage their grow in numbers. The smell will go off after sometime & after some water change. U will also get a layer of oil film on yr surface of yr tank, so u might want to consider an inexpensive surface skimmer to remove it.

Some brand of powerheads that is gd.

Idra

Rena

Aquaclear

Maxijet(Aquarium Sys)

Eheim

Aquabee

Dun get taiwan or china brand, they are useless. Overrated in the vol of water it can move.

U can start dripping yr kalk & reefbuilder to enough the coralline growth. SO by the time yr tank finish cycling, you will have quite an amount of coralline in tank. U will also need a cucumber after yr water parameters is ok. 0 NH4 0 NO2 min NO3.

Wei

[Sinn]

where are u staying?

it would help if we cud suggest shops near yer place

[Tanzy]

lona,

Those lumps of LR won't be sufficient for the tank. When you add more rocks the tank will cycle again due to LR die off. Best to do it all at once and get all the cycling over and done with. Adding bit by bit is very inefficient. Top up the sand, fill up with water and ensure the system is running properly then add more LR. Excess water can be easily drained.

Kalkwasser is available at most LFS. It's also known as cacium hydroxide.

Pospeh,

I'll have to disagree with you regarding cycling LR in a pail for weeks and not directly in the tank. The water circulation will be poor resulting in anaerobic conditions and you will lose so many good organisms, even corals. Only pests seem to survive that kind of treatment. The LR you get after a few weeks will be only good for base rock. Also, you'll need a lot of pails. If you want to be absolutely sure there will be no die off when LR is added to a tank, then just use dead rock. Cheaper too!

[lona]

Hi,

Wei> I saw an eheim one the other day..model 1260 or something I think, the guy at the lfs said that's more for returning water to the main tank from the sump. Are there any models I should particularly look for?

Sinn> I stay at koon seng road..reef aquarius is right behind my place, but I don't really like going there or to kwang's cos I think the stuff's quite expensive, and there's nothing much in the shop. If you're aware of any other shop nearby I'd be willing to go take a look..but I took a list off one of the threads here..some sort of compilation..been to some of them already..still looking for time to go..

Tanzy> Ok..I'll take your advice and add in everything at once. My logic before this was: I'm not in any big rush..and can't really afford to spend too much at one go..so I figure add slowly. And if I make any mistakes I can correct sooner..rather than after everything's gone in see? I thought maybe once some bacteria's established, any subsequent mini cycles will be faster, and will load the tank gradually.. but I'll follow your directions over the next few days..but the LR'll have to wait till after CNY.. ..thanks for the heads up..

[lona]

Just as an afterthought, would there be any difference if I took calcium hydroxide from the lab? Is there any diff from the ones the lfs sell?

Anyone knows?

[Tanzy]

What lab? Sec, JC, Uni or workplace? It is possible but you must be sure that it has not been contaminated with something else. Especially in schools where the lab discipline is very poor. I'll suggest not to unless it is an unopenned container.

[Sinn]

aquamart near autobacs sells kalk....

however, personally i dont mind travelling to petmart at serangoon north to get stuff....

its cheaper that aquamart

hope that helps....

[lona]

Tanzy> At workplace, but ok..think I'll buy it from a lfs. Better don't take from work..dunno who uses it also..thanks

Sinn> I've only not been to aquamart..I know where it is..only haven't had the time to go down. Petmart I can easily settle..so I'll prb buy from there..I bought some stuff from there before..not too shabby..

Thanks guys.

[lona]

Tanzy> I just read that some forms of cleaner shrimp will go after the majano anemone..could I go that way? Cos I was already thinking of getting a pair..

Was looking at some pictures of the aiptasia, but it don't really look like the one I have..

The size is roughly 3mm..it's basically a round disc, dark leaf green in colour. There is a single ring of white spots around the circumference..(it's so small I can't even see whether the spots are tentacles or not, much less take a picture.) On touching it it retracts..

The pictures I've seen online show aiptasia which are reddish brown and have very long obvious tentacles..but then again those don't show what size they are..

Please advise..

[Tanzy]

The peppermint shrimp from the caribbean sea eats aiptasia but not majano. It's not available locally but I was thinking of bringing some back from UK in July.

What you are describing is nonspecific, it could be a zooanthid too. Do you have a picture?

[lona]

Tanzy> I'd take a picture but it's really too small..the thing is like 3mm diameter only leh..I'll try to get a pic tonight and post it online if it's distinguishable..if not I'll keep looking for the pictures of the names you throw up..the majano anemone also doens't exactly look like the thing I have either..

are zooanthids bad?

[eprouve]

Most LFS would have Kalkwasser. Its a clear plastic bottle with white powder in it (blue label). I got mine from Petmart, but I haven't started using it yet. $12 or $16... somewhere in that range. I'll check the volume when I get home.

Wei--> What's wrong with ORCA?