Starting a 2x1.5x1.5ft nano tank.

[Evolutionz]

hey guys, is those CREE LEDs really so much better than T5HO tubes? have been reading up alot and it seems like all those new set ups are all going LEDs and most only CREE brand ones. hardly spot anyone going for T5HO despite LED initial cost is so much higher..

[MadScientist]

T5, heat goes to tank, higher wattage, need to keep replacing tubes regularly, unit tend to be bigger/bulkier. Led, literally no heat going to tank, lower wattage, slimmer, nicer looking units, no need for bulb replacement, shimmering effect (like having MH without the heat). Which 1 will you choose?

[Evolutionz]

T5, heat goes to tank, higher wattage, need to keep replacing tubes regularly, unit tend to be bigger/bulkier. Led, literally no heat going to tank, lower wattage, slimmer, nicer looking units, no need for bulb replacement, shimmering effect (like having MH without the heat). Which 1 will you choose?

was thinking if having an extra fan blowing the heat away from the light set will help. But i also read that LED's growth rate for corals is not as good as T5HO, is that correct?

Right now the thing keeping me away from LEDs is the initial cost..

[MadScientist]

extra fan = extra wattage, noise and higher evaporative rate. ya, a number of people experience better growth rate with t5 than led. that's why there's some whom use both. if you factor in costs of good t5 tubes and electricity, led will be slightly more cost effective than t5 in the long run.

[Evolutionz]

Yea im actually looking into Eshine Aquawasher right now.. should be getting them for my lighting.. would be using Hydor aqua color moonlight to simulate dawn and dusk too. i wonder how long should the main lighting be on?

[kaykay]

Yea im actually looking into Eshine Aquawasher right now.. should be getting them for my lighting.. would be using Hydor aqua color moonlight to simulate dawn and dusk too. i wonder how long should the main lighting be on?

Hey bro, do note that moonlight vs dusk/dawn is very different.

Within your constraint of 2aquawashers, each with a power cord only, you can time one set to be "on" for a while before the 2nd set is turned on.

Reverse for the ending of the photo period.

[mw1611]

I using the aquawashers too.. With a Beamswork Double Power 1600.. This is what I do:

8pm - First strip of blue lights turns on,

8.30pm - Next strip of blue lights turn on,

9pm - First strip of white lights come on

9.30pm - Next strip of white lights come on with the Beamswork

White lights are on for 4 hrs for now, will be increasing to 5hrs within the next two weeks, at half hour more per week.. My white lights go off half an hour apart from each other, then the blue lights are left on until 2.30pm and 3pm respectively and my 2x solite + 1x hydor moonlights take over till its 8pm again..

[Evolutionz]

Hey bro, do note that moonlight vs dusk/dawn is very different.

Within your constraint of 2aquawashers, each with a power cord only, you can time one set to be "on" for a while before the 2nd set is turned on.

Reverse for the ending of the photo period.

oh i initially thought that can light up the tank a little so the fishes/corals wont get light shocked.. yea will probably do that..

I using the aquawashers too.. With a Beamswork Double Power 1600.. This is what I do:

8pm - First strip of blue lights turns on,

8.30pm - Next strip of blue lights turn on,

9pm - First strip of white lights come on

9.30pm - Next strip of white lights come on with the Beamswork

White lights are on for 4 hrs for now, will be increasing to 5hrs within the next two weeks, at half hour more per week.. My white lights go off half an hour apart from each other, then the blue lights are left on until 2.30pm and 3pm respectively and my 2x solite + 1x hydor moonlights take over till its 8pm again..

wow! seems like u got alot of lighting bro!

[Evolutionz]

Anyway im currently toying the idea of a chiller... i was thinking if i get a 1/10hp chiller( for 2x1.5x1.5) or a slightly more powerful one if im going for 2 ft cube and i set it to 26 - 27C and since softies and LPS dun require that cold water. i wonder how much will the electricity bill be? main concern is bills though.. anyone able to provide their bills for a 1/10hp chiller on a 30g tank set to 26 - 27c?

Thanks!

[Sprinter]

Hi Bro my tank 34g red sea max. Chiller 1/10 monthly bill $20

[Evolutionz]

Hi Bro my tank 34g red sea max. Chiller 1/10 monthly bill $20

Theres a guy selling the red sea max 130 (34g) an it comes with a 1/15hp mini artica chiller.. smaller hp means chiller got to run more often and in turn higher bills right?

[slapper]

Welcome to this hobby!

Many schools of thought on how to go about starting. There's no right or wrong answer here, just preference.

My preference is to start small, and simplicity is the key. Therefore, no sump, just canister (get a good one) and skimmer. Was using a Dymax IQ5 skimmer for my 2ft tank but just changed to a RIO HOB Skimmer. Still trying out.

Who needs a chiller if you can replace it with 2 Dymax vortex fans? My water temp hardly exceeds 30C. Averages at 28.5 during the day, and good enough to keep my octopus coral.

Here is a pic of my tank to share.

http://www.sgreefclub.com/forum/uploads/gallery/album_275/gallery_16977_275_28388.jpg

Hey guys, i have been reading lots of stuff recently regarding a nano tank and finally decided to start a thread today. i have been a lover of marine fish long time ago and has all the while been keeping freshwater fishes (planted tank) but previous attempt to set up one was always scrapped in the end due to being financially strapped cause im still a student. So recently i thought its time i let go my freshwater set up to dive into marine setup but still i intend to go on a budget. really need all the help i can get now to clear all my doubts. it will be at least 1 - 2 months more till i do a set up as exams are coming up and will only do so after it. meanwhile im starting to plan early to make sure i do not make any big mistake.. most of the equipments i'll be getting should be 2nd hand as well. the set up will have corals as well since they are the ones that attracted me so much. probably Zoas(my fav) mushrooms, GSP and some LSP corals?

here are my bunch of questions :

Tank size :

2x1.5x1.5ft (was thinking if a 2ft cube will be a better size..) 30 gallon tank.

Filtration :

i currently have a fluval Fx5 (2300l/hr) canister filter filled with biohome(red) and eheim Mech, running on my 4x2x2ft planted tank. can this be reused for my 2ft tank?

i know sump tank would be a better choice since i can put my skimmer there and also have more volume but is that really alot better than a canister filter?

Lighting :

LEDs seems to be the trend now for lighting.. but due to being on a budget i doubt i will go for LEDs. those high end ones that works well for marine are really expensive. i'll probably go for T5 or T5HO lighting. is 2x24watt or should i go for 4x24watt for the above mentioned corals?

Cooling :

I will be using fan to chill the tank down. i can achieve 27C easily on my 422 even on such hot days now. so i can probably expect 27 - 28C on a marine since it has more equipments running. is that cold enough for zoas, gsp and lsp corals? i know that chiller would be a much better choice but my parents rejected the idea due to the electricity bill and the heat expelled by the chiller.

Skimmer :

i read that bubble magus seems to be one of the better bang for the buck skimmer out there. and i also read that if i want to have a well stocked with both fishes and corals tank its better to go for a overated skimmer. so will BM NAC3+, NAC3.5 or NAC5A be a better choice? But that 3 skimmer will only be used if im going for sump tank, if not it will probably be BM NAC QQ for hang on inside tank. and what are the difference?

Wavemaker :

i have a sunsun 2000l/hr wavemaker. is this sufficient?

Substrate :

i noticed caribsea live sand seem to be a popular choice. will a thin layer be sufficient?

Salt mix :

Redsea salt seems to be popular. what is the most bang for the buck marine salt out there that is good enough for corals too? and is SG1.025 be the specific gravity i should aim for?

Nutrients addition:

is this needed if the salt is gonna provide those stuff like calcium, magnesium etc etc?

Live rock :

Where to buy good and cured live rock?

How many fishes and corals can i keep if i do 10 - 15% WC weekly?

That should be all for now.. i apologies for the long questions cause i cant find the exact answer to mine through searches and googling..

Thanks in advance!

[Evolutionz]

Hey bro slapper thanks for replying to my thread! i've seen ur tank and its indeed one of the nicest 2ft around and yet ur equipments are so simple! i've read that canister filters always end up building lots of nitrates due to the mulm and dirt being clogged.. i have a fx5 though.. as for why im thinking of a chiller now, mainly due to the high evaporation rate caused by fan. What is ur water changing regime anyway? u WC and top up evaporated water with RO/DI water? or just treated tap water?how old is this tank too?

Thanks!!!

[mw1611]

Hmm.. IMO, with a chiller, your top up regime will definitely be less of a trouble.. For me, I'm using a Artica 1/15 chiller on my 2FT Cube with IOS, and i'm topping up approximately 250ml of distilled water everyday.. Haha.. I got 3 sets of lights, 2 aquawashers and 1 Beamswork.. I think got some bros even more fierce with lights than me leh

[Evolutionz]

Hmm.. IMO, with a chiller, your top up regime will definitely be less of a trouble.. For me, I'm using a Artica 1/15 chiller on my 2FT Cube with IOS, and i'm topping up approximately 250ml of distilled water everyday.. Haha.. I got 3 sets of lights, 2 aquawashers and 1 Beamswork.. I think got some bros even more fierce with lights than me leh

Hey bro, wont a 1/15 hp chiller be under powered on ur 2ft cube? whats ur chiller bills? woah.. how come still need to top up even when u used chiller?

[FuEl]

Canisters can be used but you must remember to clean them regularly, at least once a month.

When you cycle your tank, remember to add sufficient ammonia if not it's not a complete cycle. This is where most people go wrong when they assumed they have cycled the tank just because ammonia reading is 0 to begin with. It simply means insufficient ammonia has been added to even start the cycle. The purpose of cycling is to build up bacterial populations to a level that will be fully capable (not partially) of handling the waste produced by livestock upon stocking.

Sources of ammonia can be ammonium chloride, products like Biomature from waterlife, prawn meat, decomposing fish, etc. I prefer the first two methods. Get an ammonia test kit (API recommended) and aim for 8ppm ammonia. Add a source of bacteria either from liverock, livesand or from commercial bacteria solutions. Keep testing weekly until you get 0 ammonia. Nitrites should be 0 for the cycle to be considered complete. Change 50-60% water after full cycle to remove nitrates and you are ready to go.

This is how troublesome cycling is meant to be, most people get it wrong. That's responsible for most new tank syndromes.

[Sprinter]

Bro my red sea max 130 running with a hp 1/10 telco chiller it take temp from 27'c to 26'c about 45min. Next kick in 2 hr depand on your room temp.

[slapper]

Thanks bro for liking my tank. You are correct. Fan results in high evaporation rate. I need to top up half a bottle of distilled water (1.5L bottle) every day. But I still think it's cheaper than using a chiller in the long run!

Well, you may use tap water too, but beware. Tap water has phosphate and may result in hair algae growth. Which is the reason why I switched to distilled.

My tank's been around for almost half a year. It experienced melt downs etc. Every setback is a learning lesson. It has since stabilised although I'm having trouble introducing tangs in, they always end up getting itch. Common for small tanks. Other than that, everything else is fine.

Hey bro slapper thanks for replying to my thread! i've seen ur tank and its indeed one of the nicest 2ft around and yet ur equipments are so simple! i've read that canister filters always end up building lots of nitrates due to the mulm and dirt being clogged.. i have a fx5 though.. as for why im thinking of a chiller now, mainly due to the high evaporation rate caused by fan. What is ur water changing regime anyway? u WC and top up evaporated water with RO/DI water? or just treated tap water?how old is this tank too?

Thanks!!!

[mw1611]

Hey bro, wont a 1/15 hp chiller be under powered on ur 2ft cube? whats ur chiller bills? woah.. how come still need to top up even when u used chiller?

Hmm.. Nope! Its working well, temperature set at 26 degrees.. I've got another thermometer reading the water temperature between 24-25 degrees.. I haven got the chance to measure my bill for the chiller.. But it doesn't kick it that often.. And yup! Still need to top up, but of course not as much, cause there would still be evaporation taking place, only not that severe as using fan..

[Sprinter]

Bro i use to top up every 2 day half a lit. mix with Kh & Ca by powder form Kent marine product.because my tank consumtion of Kh & Ca very high.About tank itch due to water temp high & low as i know useing fan to bring down temp is only 1'C and by chiller is constun cool. Bro try to set your chiller from 26 to 27c not 2c by setting 2c chiller kick in take longer time. as my current tank red sea max 130 electricty monthly bill $20

[Evolutionz]

Canisters can be used but you must remember to clean them regularly, at least once a month.

When you cycle your tank, remember to add sufficient ammonia if not it's not a complete cycle. This is where most people go wrong when they assumed they have cycled the tank just because ammonia reading is 0 to begin with. It simply means insufficient ammonia has been added to even start the cycle. The purpose of cycling is to build up bacterial populations to a level that will be fully capable (not partially) of handling the waste produced by livestock upon stocking.

Sources of ammonia can be ammonium chloride, products like Biomature from waterlife, prawn meat, decomposing fish, etc. I prefer the first two methods. Get an ammonia test kit (API recommended) and aim for 8ppm ammonia. Add a source of bacteria either from liverock, livesand or from commercial bacteria solutions. Keep testing weekly until you get 0 ammonia. Nitrites should be 0 for the cycle to be considered complete. Change 50-60% water after full cycle to remove nitrates and you are ready to go.

This is how troublesome cycling is meant to be, most people get it wrong. That's responsible for most new tank syndromes.

Yea thanks bro for ur info, decided not to go for canister and go for IOS/Sump instead.

Bro my red sea max 130 running with a hp 1/10 telco chiller it take temp from 27'c to 26'c about 45min. Next kick in 2 hr depand on your room temp.

i currently aiming a Red sea Max 130 too! do u have any problem with the stock skimmer?

Thanks bro for liking my tank. You are correct. Fan results in high evaporation rate. I need to top up half a bottle of distilled water (1.5L bottle) every day. But I still think it's cheaper than using a chiller in the long run!

Well, you may use tap water too, but beware. Tap water has phosphate and may result in hair algae growth. Which is the reason why I switched to distilled.

My tank's been around for almost half a year. It experienced melt downs etc. Every setback is a learning lesson. It has since stabilised although I'm having trouble introducing tangs in, they always end up getting itch. Common for small tanks. Other than that, everything else is fine.

Thanks bro for your info, i should be using distilled water as well..

Hmm.. Nope! Its working well, temperature set at 26 degrees.. I've got another thermometer reading the water temperature between 24-25 degrees.. I haven got the chance to measure my bill for the chiller.. But it doesn't kick it that often.. And yup! Still need to top up, but of course not as much, cause there would still be evaporation taking place, only not that severe as using fan..

Thanks bro for your info!

Bro i use to top up every 2 day half a lit. mix with Kh & Ca by powder form Kent marine product.because my tank consumtion of Kh & Ca very high.About tank itch due to water temp high & low as i know useing fan to bring down temp is only 1'C and by chiller is constun cool. Bro try to set your chiller from 26 to 27c not 2c by setting 2c chiller kick in take longer time. as my current tank red sea max 130 electricty monthly bill $20

yea plan to set to that temp if i get a chiller.. thanks!

[Sprinter]

Hi bro any one intersted my Red sea max 130 complete with chiller plug & play. Low price because I m going for a upgrade. Bro mention about the skimmer it working well . For RSM skimmer you need to adjust the air intake and look for fine bubble. Contact no 98189486 can be arrange for viewing tks.

[Sprinter]

WTS Red sea max 130 complete with chiller $500 contact no 98189486 location Sembawang.

[Evolutionz]

Hey guys a few more questions...

1) Let say i purchase a full set from another reefer who already have live rocks (though not enough), sand (not sure live sand or not) and its already very stable, rocks with purple coraline algae. If i purchase and buy seawater from irwarna and set it up immediately, will the bateria in the rock and sand as well as the coraline algae die? or will it end up shortening my cycling period? i can wait 1 month cycling without touching it no problem though.

2) Should i turn on the skimmer if its during cycling period?

3) Chiller no need to be on during cycling right? since only rock and sand..

4) Stuff like purigen or other nirate/po4 remover issit needed to be added in during cycling?

Thanks!

[MadScientist]

for me, I will go for yes to 2, 3 and 4.

Reasons behind answers:

Technically, it would be better if you have no chiller = higher temperature = higher metabolic/growth rate for bacteria, no skimmer and removers = higher levels of nutrient levels for bacteria. However, once we start to use them, the temperature reduces, stressing and killing off some of the bacteria. With lower nutrient, bacterial population starts to die off rapidly. The dead bacteria population may cause a mini nutrient spike. Hence, my preference of cycling a tank with parameters as close to normal situation as possible.

As for 1, it depends on how you handle them. I rarely hear people acclimatizing the rocks with dripping method. You should expect some of the population to die off, however, with that said, the population should rebound fairly quickly. Coraline algae can produce spores when stressed, not much of a problem as it should recover slowly if anything were to happen. As for ending up with shortening of cycling period, I do not believe in cycling periods. As long as there's a reasonable population of bacteria around, it should be fine. Our tanks are cycling every single minute, when bacteria population dying and growing according to nutrient levels. I would recommend a cycling period for sterile tanks though as there is no bacteria population to speak of in the first place.

If your system is unable to handle bioload introduction shortly, I would say your filtration is rather insufficient. For me, I will oversize the filtration to the level where even if the bacteria population suddenly gets wiped off, it can still sustain the bioload.