SantaMonica

Interesting. Can you show more of the LED panel, and how it sits in relation to the screen? You are cleaning weekly now, correct?

Successes Update: Macman on the RF site: "To show how affective these scrubbers are I have carried out a little experiment. As you may know I have been running a small 180 litre tank fully stocked with corals and fish, running an external filter and an internal filter. My nitrates have always been between 7 and 12, but I recently had a death of one of my fish and corals which put the nitrate through the roof (and I mean through the roof!) Between 80 and 100 VERY SERIOUS. I decided with my new 7 week old 400 litre tank (which only runs a scrubber) and has nitrates at <1 to carry out a few water exchanges [between the new and old tanks]. I exchanged approximately 80-100 litres in about 5 days, and saw my nitrates go from <1 to nearer 50 in the new tank (A little worrying, but to be expected when considering the concentration of nitrates in the smaller tank). That [nitrate] test was carried out on 12th March. I carried out the same [nitrate] test last night, 25th March, on the scrubber tank and my nitrates are 25. Like I said before this tank has only a scrubber within its system, and live rock. The only thing I did notice [on the new tank] before the water exchange was that I was getting to a period where I was getting a nice light green algae build up on the scrubber, and once I had done the water exchange the algae went back to a dirty black/brown on the scrubber. Only this morning have I started to see a little green again, so it has set me back a few weeks. This system does work and this proofs it. I must admit I was a little concerned when my water went near to 50, but the scrubber came good for me." Melonbob on the LR site: "Well, just figured I'd update my success story. February 2nd I set up my algae scrubber, and clean one side every friday. I've gone from at least 30-40 nitrates down to less than 5 as of todays test! And lets just say I'm very lazy with water changes.......lol! I'm jazzed!" Creetin on the SRC site: "day 60 update...! i prolly will stop counting the days but so far i have to say 2 months into the scrubber thingy and i am totally sold on it! its amazing such a great kick algae ###### idea has remained eluded from most of us...so SM, allow me to say that you are truly my idol!!! This has got to be one of the single most important 'discoveries' being revealed...."

Update: Screen roughness If your screen is only growing little spots of algae here and there, it means the screen is not rough enough. What is happening is that algae is trying to attach and grow all over the screen, but the water washes the algae away. Only a few areas have enough roughness for the algae to hang on in the water flow. So, you need to remove the screen and really really really sand/scrape/rough it up. If it's a clear screen (i.e., acrylic), you should not be able to see through it. If it's a plastic canvas screen, it should feel prickly. For highest results (and highest maintenance)... rug canvas works the best, but it only lasts so long before it comes apart. Then you have to make a new one. Whatever you use, make it as rough as possible.

Update: Other ways to reduce nutrients If you are using a scrubber, here are some other permanent ways to reduce nutrients (aside from feeding less), starting with the easiest first: o Remove floss/foam/socks (they trap food and cause it to rot). o Remove chaeto (also traps food and causes it to rot). o Remove bio balls (or similar media) slowly (they create excess nitrate, and trap food). o Remove all sand in your sump (food settles in sand and rots); if anything, use LR. o Use kalkwasser (lime water) in your top-off (the higher pH causes phosphate to precipitate). o Change any area of the sump that lets food settle to the bottom; all food should continue through the sump and back to the display (this is why an open sump is best). o Reduce sand in your display to 1/4 inch (6mm), or increase it to 4 inches (10cm). o Using an ultraviolet sterilizer also helps reduce phosphates, but it also kills the live pods that come from the scrubber; thus it's not recommended for normal use.

I just took some pics of the sps, will post soon.

If the purpose of a water change is to remove nitrate and phosphate, then you don't need to do them any more. The scrubber (as long as it is growing algae) removes everything that needs removing (just like the ocean). A scrubber, however, does not remove things like medications and poisions.

Yes your lights are good for that small size. And yes turn off the skimmer; why remove all that food.

Looks really neat. Where is the pump?

No tanker, that is just the quotes from Eric's articles, from his Food series. There are more from him, and more from others, that I'll post periodically.

Part 7 of 7: "The Food of Reefs, Part 7: Dissolved Nutrients" by Eric Borneman http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-04/eb/index.php "Mucus consists of mainly sugars and glycoproteins - soluble materials in and of themselves. However, the formation of mucus, and its release in a matrix of chains of these materials, may result in a particulate material. This material is both utilized directly by many organisms, and also forms the basis for a predominant fraction of the particulate "marine snow" on reefs. "In fact, reef waters are 30-40% higher in DOM [disolved organic matter] than oceanic waters. "In terms of determining the degree to which organisms may use dissolved material as significant source of nutrition, one may examine the surface area of the outer cell membranes exposed to such materials. In general, the larger the absorptive area, the more likely organisms are to depend on absorption. Some cell surfaces are covered with many finger-like processes called microvilli that greatly increase the surface area of the membrane. Furthermore, the presence of cilia is often a good indicator of absorptive surfaces. Perhaps not surprisingly, corals have extensive microvilli and cilia. "Corals are able to take up various forms of both organic and inorganic dissolved nitrogen. "Even slightly elevated nitrogen levels can quickly result in rapid increases in the density of zooxanthellae, as they use it to fuel their own reproduction" [and thus turn the coral brown] "It is also somewhat equivocal that corals are able to utilize nitrate (which exists nearly totally in its ionic state at physiological pH) at all, and an inability to find nitrate reductase in many studies, makes the ultimate importance of this dissolved nitrogen source to corals (and anemones) rather tenuous. However, it is unambiguously true that ammonium is a sought-after nitrogen source by both coral host and algal partner. "Humic (refractory) compounds: These yellowing compounds are typically found at relatively high levels in aquaria, and they are removed with protein skimming and activated carbon. Humic materials have been thought to be relatively inert and unavailable for use as a nutrient source. However, studies have shown that organisms from bacteria to brine shrimp (Artemia salina) can utilize humic substances as a source of nutrients. "In terms of corals reefs, the amounts of most dissolved nutrients, except carbon in most cases, are very low. "The higher nutrient levels may cause corals and other symbiotic partnerships to decline as the partner algae preferentially utilize the increased nutrient sources to the expense of the host. [and thus browning of the coral occurs] "Without question, corals and many reef organisms are able to utilize dissolved nutrients to help meet their energy requirements and to use in tissue growth.

Glad to see everyone's algae growing where it should be

Yes but to win that have to eat the algae

Update: Nutrients vs. Nutrition It's important to understand the difference between these two words. "Nutrients" generally means Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate, which are the things that you measure with your test kits, and which are also the things that nuisance algae feed on. "Nutrition", however, generally means food for corals and fish. Natural reefs in the ocean are high in "nutrition" (lots of food particles floating around), but low in "nutrients" (nitrate and phosphate). Aquariums that have skimmers, or other mechanical filters like foam or floss, are low in nutrition because the food is filtered out, but they are high in nutrients because the Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate is not filtered. Aquariums that have only scrubbers are high in nutrition but low in nutrients. Aquariums with both skimmers and scrubbers are low in both nutrition and nutrients.

Maybe not idol, but how about a Creetin scrubber reality show?

Question: Anyone know where to buy marine self-priming pumps? Several people are trying to build the top-of-nano scrubber I posted, but in order to put the pump in the scrubber (and thus not in the display), the pump needs to be able to pull water up and out of the display. So far, the only thing found is the Eclipse nano hoods with small pumps built in, and a few other HOB filters with small self-priming pumps built in. But these are built-in and molded to the other parts. What is really needed is a self-contained pump that is separate from the other parts, and which of course is aquarium safe, and in the 70 to 150 gph range (266 to 570 lph).

Nice plumbing! Are you using a slot? What bulb is that? Improvement: Move the light much closer to the screen, and point it at the middle, not the top. Then add another light on the other side.

Part 2 of 7: Taken from "From the Food of Reefs to the Food of Corals" by Eric Borneman http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-08/eb/index.php "Nitrogen levels in [natural] coral reef waters are typically extraordinarily low, with most being found as ammonia. This is in contrast to aquaria, where the dominant nitrogen species is usually nitrate. Nitrogen is the be-all end-all for zooxanthellae growth and reproduction [zooxanthellae is what photosynthesizes light into food for corals]. By limiting nitrogen in the form of excretion products, the [coral] polyps keep the zooxanthellae in the numbers and density that maximize photosynthetic efficiency for its own use. Using several released compounds, most of which are still unidentified, the [coral] polyp stimulates the zooxanthellae to release virtually all of the products of its photosynthesis, and these are then used by the polyp for its own needs. If nitrogen was made readily available to the zooxanthellae (for example, if high levels were present in the water and this dissolved nitrogen diffused into the coral tissue), it could then be accessed by the algae without limitation by the polyp, and zooxanthellae could begin to grow and reproduce like a phytoplankton culture. In this case, the symbiosis becomes less advantageous to the coral, and it will expel some of the symbionts to try and re-establish maximal benefit from its algal partners. As a practical note, when very high densities of zooxanthellae exist in coral tissue [because of to much nitrogen], the resultant coloration of the coral is usually a rich or dark brown color. "Coral mucus, in turn, and as was shown in the previous article, is itself a food source to the reef. [skimmer remove mucus, but do not remove nitrogen]

If their purpose is to lower nutrients, then no.

Successes Update: sean48183 on the SWF site: "Alright, just tested NO3 and ta da! 0 NO3! Awesome. Still have some hair algae in display, but appears to have slowed down. My scrubber is still getting mostly brown slime and some green. Don't really care. It is working. Have to clean every couple days because it is growing so fast. Anyone who is debating trying -- quit debating and just do it." ScubaDrew on the RS site: "I built a small one using the basic plans posted in the first few pages. I used a dremmel to cut the slot in the PVC and used fishing line through the small holes in the plastic divider material to hold it up. My tank measured 0’s in all the algae related categories prior to building it, but my tank was still growing a lot of HA and some cyano. I’ve only got one florescent ‘flood’ style light on one side of the scrubber right now due to having placed it in an already crowded sump. I had a full coat of algae in about 10 days, and cleaned off about ¾ of what had accumulated at that time. Now I need to clean off a large, heavy, handful every week! With continued cleaning in my DT, I’ve really made progress in getting the DT algae free. Thanks for the info, I think the ATS will be a part of my system for a long time to come." RiaanP on MASA site: "Scrubber running now for four weeks. NO3 0mg/l (first time EVER). PO4 between .025 and 0.5 mg/l. 4 weeks ago NO3 was over 100 mg/l and PO4 was over 2 mg/l. So a scrubber really works."

A 10 inch by 8 inch screen is a bit small, but might work is the lights are strong on both sides (at least 23W CFL floods). Don't try LED unless you don't need results.

Update: FW cleanings Pods eating the algae: The reason you need to run freshwater over your screen every week is because you want to kill the baby pods that start to grow and eat the algae. You may not see the eaten areas, unless the algae is very thin like this: However, pods are always growing and multiplying. And they eat algae. The reason this is a problem is that (1) pods are constantly flowing out of your scrubber into the tank. If they eat algae first, then the nitrate and phosphate that is in that algae gets released back into the water, and (2) you now have less algae to do the filtering. Unlike the picture above, however, the algae is usually too thick for the eaten areas to be seen. The pods stay out of the light, in the underlying layers; so you don't see what they are eating. By cleaning your screen in freshwater, you kill the pods that are on your screen. They will start multiplying again within a few minutes, but at least you can keep them under 7 days old. And even if you clean only half of the screen each week, you still want to wash the whole screen in FW.

Update: N and P are invisible: It's important to know/remember that Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate, which is what your test kits read, and which are also what causes the nuisance algae to grow in your tank, are invisible. You can see the results of the nitrate and phosphate; it's the nuisance algae. But you cannot see the nitrate and phosphate itself. This fact causes the most problems when people see a lot of stuff (food) that their skimmers have removed, but wonder why their nuisance algae is not being removed (skimmers don't remove Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate), and also when their phosphate tests zero, but they still have algae on certain parts of the rocks (the invisible phosphate is coming out of the rocks.)

Here is a Nano hang-on-back or hang-on-top box scrubber that somebody could build to sell. That is the reason for the tighly fitting lid, and the built-in pump; no decisions or adjustments are needed by the customer. After building it, you could buy a banner ad on this site to sell them. However if you were just building it for yourself, you can make the lighting simpler by just setting a T5HO light fixture on top of the box (although you would not get the benefit of the noise and light being sealed off by the lid), and you could make the pump simpler by just putting the pump in the tank (up near the waterline): I'm not providing any links or part numbers, because it's up to the person building it to make sure that everything works together properly (it's not a beginner's project). Here are a few notes: This scrubber MUST be placed above the tank, so it drains down into the tank. The overflow drain must be lower than the bulbs. The pump must be self-priming, capable of pulling water up 12" or so from the tank. There should be no holes in the sides or bottom of the box, except for the drains; all other tubing and wires should come out of the top of the box. This will eliminate any possibility of leaky connections. Two bulbs will provide more filtering than one will. And if you can fit three, all the better. 12" T5 bulbs are only 8 watts each. The screen needs a solid backing, with some plastic canvas laid on over it. The mounting brackets could hook onto the top of the nano, or they could be made into extended legs that go all the way down to the cabinet. Or, the whole box scrubber could be set on top of the nano, and be moved as needed. The pump should be able to run "dry" without burning up. The upflow-tubing should not go very far into the display; maybe a half inch or so. This limits how much water can be pulled out of the tank if there is a problem. The size shown, 13.5" X 3" X 3", gives a one-sided screen of about 40 square inches. This will fit neatly behind (and on top of) a typical 6 or 8 gal nano without sticking out, but will also provide enough filtering for an 18 gal nano that gets weekly cleanings. For 24 gal and larger, use two separate scrubbers. This has the added benefit of redundancy, and, allows you to keep one running while the other one grows back after cleaning. Overflow protection test: (1) plug up the drain at the bottom of the screen; the water should rise and start going out the overflow drain without spilling out of the lid, and it should not get high enough to touch the bulbs. (2) Now, also plug up the overflow tube. The pump should start running dry before the box spills, if you placed the upflow tubing high enough in the tank. The T5 sockets should be the "waterproof" type, they keeps spray and salt out. They are not really "waterproof", but they are made for aquarium use. Basic costs of building one (multiples would be cheaper)... Box w/lid: $40 Pump: $35 2 Bulbs: $15 Sockets: $20 Ballast: $35 Misc: $40 --------------- Total: $185 USD

Part 6 of 7: "The Food of Reefs, Part 6: Particulate Organic Matter" by Eric Borneman http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-03/eb/index.php "This article will address a very important food to corals and many other animals, particulate organic material (POM). This food source has many names, including detritus [waste], floculant organic matter, reef snow, marine snow, and suspended organic material. "Not so long ago, marine aquarists made every attempt to be assured that their water column was "polished." I never fully understood the term, but the premise was that a clean water column was a good water column. Various means were employed to accomplish this, including the use of various power filters, mechanical flosses and screens, sterilizers, ozonizers, canister filters, diatom filters, foam fractionators [skimmers] and many other devices. [However] "polished" water might not be in the best interest of reef tanks or corals. "Particulate organic material has its origins in life, being composed by and large of the remains, secretions and excretions of living organisms. On coral reefs, it is composed mostly of dead algae, bacteria, mucus, and feces. "When food, waste, or other particulate organic matter (POM) is trapped, especially in an aerobic environment, it is acted upon by several types of bacteria that break down the substances into more basic dissolved organic and inorganic components. Some of these breakdown components are organic acids and refractory compounds that can impart a yellow tint to the water column. This yellowing has been called "gelbstoff." However, both the substances remaining after [various types of] filtration, as well as the substances removed by the filtration, can be utilized by the life in the aquaria, and are taken up by corals, sponges, some other invertebrates, phytoplankton, bacteria, and algae. "On reef slopes and crests, the [waste] material is mostly coral mucus, while over the reef flats and lagoons, the material is mostly algae and fecal matter. This material, by itself, has a high carbon content. However, it acts as a substrate for bacteria, ciliates, cyanobacteria, and other microorganisms that coat the particles. Bacteria can even convert dissolved organic material (DOM) into particulate organic material (POM) by aggregating it in the presence of carbon. This provides a substantially enriched particle replete with amino acids and valuably higher nitrogen content. As such, detritus [waste] becomes a very nutritious food source for many organisms. It is such a complex "dirt", that detritus has been described as a completely self-contained microhabitat of its own, with plant, animal and microbial components, and its own "built-in" nutrient source. "Another major consumer group of detritus is the zooplankton. These small animals, themselves a very important food sources to reef consumers, have been found to have 90% of their gut contents composed of detritus. Mucus-producing animals, like corals, tend to trap detritus, and the material is either removed or consumed by ciliary action across the tissue surface. Many fish also consume coral mucus, and any attached particulate organic material" "Detritus [waste] forms the basis of several food webs that are part of a balanced autotrophic/heterotrophic community. It also plays a role in establishing various levels of nutrient production and decomposition. It is this material that is the principal food source for the many bacterial species that work in various nitrification and denitrification activities. Before reaching the microbial community, however, it acts as a food source for the smaller consumers such as amphipods, copepods, errant polychaetes, protozoans, flagellates, ciliates and other animals whose activities contribute to the stability and productivity of a coral reef and a coral reef aquarium. "It is the microbial community, though, that is most important in the detrital processes. On the reef, the productivity of bacteria (both aerobic and anaerobic oxidation and reduction, including important sulfate reduction) depends heavily on detritus. Without this microbial community, coral reefs would cease to exist. "Corals, in particular, are notable for their consumption of detritus. All corals studied feed to some degree on POM, and coral communities have been found to remove half of the POM present on some reefs. So prevalent is this material, that it is termed "reef snow" in the wild. [...] Given the ability of so many corals to consume and utilize this material, along with its relatively high abundance and ability to provide up to 100% of corals' carbon and nitrogen requirements, it may now (hopefully) seem rather foolish to attempt to remove this material from aquaria.

Update: CFL Reflectors When I see a regular CFL bulb (not a floodlight) being used, I always say that it needs a reflector. Although it would just be easier to use CFL floodlight (which does not need a reflector), below are some reflectors you can use with regular CFL bulbs. You can find many others by searching for "CFL reflector", or by going to any hydroponics or gardening store: http://www.hydroleaf.com/categoryview.do?cat_id=107